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Thread: NGD: Starfire III-90

  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by GAD View Post
    Are you concerned that the tuners are "unwinding" the string? Or do the pegs feel loose?
    not that the pegs feel loose; rather that there is slack in the gears. You turn a bit and feel nothing is happening before they engage. I "lock" my strings with a reverse wind anyway which usually seems to work for tuning.

    Quote Originally Posted by Quantum Strummer View Post
    My beef with Rotomatics isn't about stability (they're fine) but feel. I can never get a sense of how much I need to turn a tuning key to get x amount of pitch change.

    My '71 S-100 has a set of '50s-era Grover Sta-Tites on it via the guy I bought it from. They're fantastic! Super stable and very precise. I wish the newer ones, while okay, were this good.

    -Dave-
    Exactly. Waverlys and Sta-tites are really good. However, isn't a Rotomatic the same basic components as a Sta-tite but in a sealed box?

    I wonder if Sta-tites are a drop in replacement for the Rotomatics.

    EDIT: I've downloaded plans for the different Grovers. when i have a moment i'll work out if they are the same dimensions
    Last edited by parker_knoll; 02-10-2019 at 09:14 AM.
    1957 X175 (ex)
    1960 Starfire III (ex)
    1962 X175
    1966 Starfire III (ex)
    1966 Duane Eddy DE-400
    2002 Starfire III-90

  2. #82
    The Sta-Tites definitely will not drop in. They use a different size bushing and have two mounting screws instead of one. I really don't like the new Sta-Tites anyway. They use a nylon compression washer that makes them stiff and even sticky sometimes. You can replace the nylon washer with a metal wavy washer and a flat washer. That improves them drastically, but why should you need to?

    Anyway, from the drawings at Stewmac, it looks like the Gotoh Magnum Lock will drop in if you want to try a different brand (I have no experience with the Gotoh.) Available with keystone or "regular" knobs
    DTC

    1958 T-100, 1964 S-50, 1964 M-65, 1976 S-300 (bolt-on neck), 1977 D-25, 1977 S-300, 1979 S-300A, 1983 S-25, 1984 Detonator, 1987 Nightbird (spruce top), 1988 D-15, 2001 Blues90, 2002 Bluesbird P90, 2014 Aristocrat

  3. #83
    Gotoh makes the best modern "Kluson" Deluxes I've come across. I've swapped out the rubbish metal key Klusons in a number of '70s Gibson SGs for Gotohs. The Rotomatic-like tuners they made for Ibanez in the early '80s are great too. I imagine they still make equivalents now. A better modern Sta-Tite would be great…

    -Dave-
    1962 F-20 Troubadour
    1970 M-75 Bluesbird
    1971 S-100 "Black Cherry"
    1973 S-100 "Nature Boy"
    1990 Nightbird Custom
    1999 X-170T
    2013 NS M-75 Aristocrat
    2016 NS S-200 T-bird

    c. 1971 Foxey Lady

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by DThomasC View Post
    The Sta-Tites definitely will not drop in. They use a different size bushing and have two mounting screws instead of one. I really don't like the new Sta-Tites anyway. They use a nylon compression washer that makes them stiff and even sticky sometimes. You can replace the nylon washer with a metal wavy washer and a flat washer. That improves them drastically, but why should you need to?
    Yep, different peg sizes: Statites are 23/64ths of an inch, Rotomatics are 25/64ths of an inch, so it would require a bushing. Thanks for the user feedback on the Statites.

    I also dislike the large size and shape of the Grover buttons aesthetically. I notice that Newark St Starfires have been issued with vintage-style tuners and look great with them:



    Isn't a Waverley a better version of a Statite? Just a shame they're so damn expensive.
    1957 X175 (ex)
    1960 Starfire III (ex)
    1962 X175
    1966 Starfire III (ex)
    1966 Duane Eddy DE-400
    2002 Starfire III-90

  5. #85
    Super Moderator Default's Avatar
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    Anybody try Hipshots? I replaced the robotuners in a LP Special with them.
    "Steve, you are a man of many goats."~ capnjuan

    "Alternatively, you could just go the ultra-relic route with it. Basically go for a look that says the amp was on fire and they put it out using belt sanders."
    (amps - I need a "99" & "50")

  6. #86
    These Waverly-style Gotoh say they are a direct fit for Rotomatics.

    I'm prepared to be guinea pig on this one if i can find them at a good price.

    https://g-gotoh.com/international/product/sxn510.html

    1957 X175 (ex)
    1960 Starfire III (ex)
    1962 X175
    1966 Starfire III (ex)
    1966 Duane Eddy DE-400
    2002 Starfire III-90

  7. #87
    From the datasheet linked to:...the SXN510 series employs a nut mount system and can be installed as a direct replacement into the same holes drilled for Rotomatic style tuners.

    Except that Rotomatics have only one mounting screw? Certainly the bushing is right (10mm screw on) but I don't think the mounting screws are in the right place or the right quantity.
    DTC

    1958 T-100, 1964 S-50, 1964 M-65, 1976 S-300 (bolt-on neck), 1977 D-25, 1977 S-300, 1979 S-300A, 1983 S-25, 1984 Detonator, 1987 Nightbird (spruce top), 1988 D-15, 2001 Blues90, 2002 Bluesbird P90, 2014 Aristocrat

  8. #88
    yep, requires a second screw, obviously, but that's easy. I'll drop them a line about the other screw but it may well be in the same place
    1957 X175 (ex)
    1960 Starfire III (ex)
    1962 X175
    1966 Starfire III (ex)
    1966 Duane Eddy DE-400
    2002 Starfire III-90

  9. #89
    Senior Member SFIV1967's Avatar
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    Nov 2010
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    10,078
    Quote Originally Posted by parker_knoll View Post
    yI'll drop them a line about the other screw but it may well be in the same place
    You have the dimmensions on their page, it's 10mm below center, but 10.5mm for Grover Rotomatics. So it's not a perfect fit.



    Ralf
    Last edited by SFIV1967; 02-17-2019 at 04:07 PM.

  10. #90
    yes, so it's a fill and redrill. Ultimately invisible but slightly annoying
    1957 X175 (ex)
    1960 Starfire III (ex)
    1962 X175
    1966 Starfire III (ex)
    1966 Duane Eddy DE-400
    2002 Starfire III-90

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