Model Number of Gotoh 12 String Tuners

Rich Cohen

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I'm curious about the Gotoh tuners that New Hartford used on its F-412 and F-512 models. Does anyone know how to install strings on these very different tuner posts?

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AcornHouse

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They are like Fender style bass tuners (and some guitar). Instead of trimming the string after its wound, you trim it first, the stick it in the hole and wind it on.
 

AcornHouse

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Look for open slot vintage tuners on YouTube. Here’s one howto.

 

Rich Cohen

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Look for open slot vintage tuners on YouTube. Here’s one howto.



Thanks Chris, that's very helpful. Some of us are timid about servicing our guitars. Especially when it comes to dealing with "vintage" parts. On YouTube some comments about this type of tuner indicate that they are a pain in the ***. Oops, I used a bad word! Sorry. I don't understand that. Now that I've learned how to use them, they seem quite efficient and easy to deal with.:drunk: Especially if one is tipsy!
 
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chazmo

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Rich, good luck stringing her up. I haven't had the pleasure of doing that myself, but I've heard that they're pretty easy when you get the hang of it. Chris' video looks about right to me.

The story behind these slotted tuners on the F-412/512 is an interesting one. I'm not sure if I remember this exactly right, but I believe I was told that it was a mistake that Gotoh sent these to New Hartford when they were building the F-412/512 prototypes. I can't recall whose mistake it was, or whether it was a custom order or not. But, the guys in the NH shop liked them so much that they stuck with them and made them part of the model! Slotted tuners are very unusual on a 12-string. In fact, I can't think of any other 12ers that have these.

My recollection is that these are not a standard part from Gotoh though, Rich. It looks like Cordoba is continuing to use them. According to the current (Cordoba) specs on guildguitars.com, they are "Custom Gotoh SE701 Open Gear in Gold"
 
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dapmdave

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Those are very easy to deal with. Probably my favorite, and I string a lot of guitars.
 

matsickma

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Definitely my favorite style of tuners. Very easy to use and get excellent non slipping string without the locking mechanism of more modern tuners.
M
 

F312

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Why is he not stringing EADGBE? No mention why. Do I not know something? A left-handed guitar could be confusing for a beginner to watch. I really don't like his way of wapping, but if it works for him, that's fine.

Ralph
 

Brad Little

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Why is he not stringing EADGBE? No mention why. Do I not know something?....

Ralph
I sometimes replace strings from the outside (starting with both Es)in. There is a theory that this keeps the tension balanced better. I think by now I do it from habit, don't think it makes a difference.
Brad
 

F312

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Maybe the strings were paired that way in the pack.

Maybe, now I wonder why they pair them in the pack, or is it, whatever you grab, put it on. It is easy to identify the size, paired, but I'm not going to change my stringing habits unless there is something beneficial I'm missing here.



Now I know some prefer to change strings one at a time because of the tension thing, I have had no problem taking the strings off for many moons.

Ralph
 

chazmo

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Ralph, I was wondering the same thing. You're right; it was unexplained in the vid. I don't think there's anything really beneficial to be found with that.

I don't actually wind to pitch until after all the strings are on (at low tension) during a string change. However, if you do, maybe this makes sense. I.e., when I'm winding to pitch, thereby putting stress on the neck, I usually do 1, 6, 2, 5, 3, and 4 to balance the twist. I'm sure it's unnecessary, but makes me feel good. :)
 

F312

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Ralph, I was wondering the same thing. You're right; it was unexplained in the vid. I don't think there's anything really beneficial to be found with that.

I don't actually wind to pitch until after all the strings are on (at low tension) during a string change. However, if you do, maybe this makes sense. I.e., when I'm winding to pitch, thereby putting stress on the neck, I usually do 1, 6, 2, 5, 3, and 4 to balance the twist. I'm sure it's unnecessary, but makes me feel good. :)

I also don't wind to pitch until I have all the strings on and then try to level the tension. When removing the strings, I "slowly" tune each string down two turns at a time until I feel the tension on the neck release. I find it may be necessary, or it makes me feel good.

Ralph
 

wileypickett

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Guitarist John Fahey changed strings before every set, and between sets if he was playing two sets a night. He could change strings faster than anyone I knew. His method of removing the "old" strings was to cut them with a wire cutter while the strings were still tuned to pitch, often two or three strings at time! He did this on his beautiful Martin guitar, hundreds, perhaps thousands, of times, over the years.

I was friends with him for 25+ years, and often hung out with him backstage. I used to inwardly cringe with every loud bang as he snapped the old strings in two, but so far as I know it had absolutely no effect on his guitar.

It's not my preferred method of changing strings, but once in a blue moon I'll do it a la Fahey, in memory of a man I miss every day.
 

F312

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Guitarist John Fahey changed strings before every set, and between sets if he was playing two sets a night. He could change strings faster than anyone I knew. His method of removing the "old" strings was to cut them with a wire cutter while the strings were still tuned to pitch, often two or three strings at time! He did this on his beautiful Martin guitar, hundreds, perhaps thousands, of times, over the years.

I was friends with him for 25+ years, and often hung out with him backstage. I used to inwardly cringe with every loud bang as he snapped the old strings in two, but so far as I know it had absolutely no effect on his guitar.

It's not my preferred method of changing strings, but once in a blue moon I'll do it a la Fahey, in memory of a man I miss every day.

That's a little overboard IMHO. Break-in time for me is at least two hours. Now he could have unstrung them strings and gave them to someone who'd appreciated them, that would be fine.

I once knew a guy that would light up a fag, take a drag and throw it down, or pass it along. I stopped smoking almost 50 years ago and must admit, the first toke is the best.

Ralph
 

wileypickett

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John was a professional player, issuing some 40 or so albums during his lifetime. (His *New Possibility* album has sold more than half a million copies to date, amazing for an instrumental acoustic guitar album!)

At the height of his success Fahey was playing a hundred+ shows a year, often two shows / four sets a night. He perspired heavily and changed tunings throughout his sets, so frequent string changes lessened the likelihood of his breaking strings on stage, though that happened regularly too.

If someone had offered to change John's barely used strings for him I know he would have been happy to give them away. He wasn't mean or stingy. But changing strings was a tedious process, and speed was what he was concerned with. Anything that slowed down the string changing process -- like slackening the strings before taking them off! -- he had no time for.

He was an endorser for D'Angelico strings -- you'll see John's ads for the company in old issues of all the guitar rags -- and the company sent him free strings by the case load. So he had the luxury of not having to pay for his strings.

Personally, I like that he didn't fetishize his guitars. Like many professional players I've encountered over the years, he viewed his guitars as tools, and he worked them very hard.

Still, it was hard not be alarmed when he got out those damn wire cutters!
 
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12 string

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Gotta love those Fahey stories!

' Strang
 

F312

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John was a professional player, issuing some 40 or so albums during his lifetime. (His *New Possibility* album has sold more than half a million copies to date, amazing for an instrumental acoustic guitar album!)

At the height of his success Fahey was playing a hundred+ shows a year, often two shows / four sets a night. He perspired heavily and changed tunings throughout his sets, so frequent string changes lessened the likelihood of his breaking strings on stage, though that happened regularly too.

If someone had offered to change John's barely used strings for him I know he would have been happy to give them away. He wasn't mean or stingy. But changing strings was a tedious process, and speed was what he was concerned with. Anything that slowed down the string changing process -- like slackening the strings before taking them off! -- he had no time for.

He was an endorser for D'Angelico strings -- you'll see John's ads for the company in old issues of all the guitar rags -- and the company sent him free strings by the case load. So he had the luxury of not having to pay for his strings.

Personally, I like that he didn't fetishize his guitars. Like many professional players I've encountered over the years, he viewed his guitars as tools, and he worked them very hard.

Still, it was hard not be alarmed when he got out those damn wire cutters!

Checked him out; yes he is a great guitarist. I'm glad you mentioned him here.

Ralph
 
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