Guild 12 strings...How do they compare , sound wise ?

JohnW63

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I have wanted an F-512 for a long time, but I really can't justify how much they go for. Not for the amount of play time it would get, once it settles down from being a NGD instrument. So unless I find a seller who doesn't know what they have and a get a deal of the century, I'll have to try to find as close as I can get, in a more reasonable budget. So, if you have multiple Guild 12 string experience, how do they sound, from 100 series on up to the 500 ? ( Don't tease me with the unobtainable 612, OK ! )

I have stayed away from the Maple ones because I do not want the uber bright jangly sound. If I have been wrong to leave those off my list, educate me.
 

F312

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Look into the F212 Standard, don't be the last to know of such guitars as the Standards. IMHO

Ralph
 

chazmo

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John, that's a tough order. I love my F-512. It's simply the king; and I've played a lot of 12 strings. It's really not about value for me; I'm talking absolute enjoyment. I can't in all honesty say anything useful to steer you away from an F-512. Sorry. :)

So, my feeling is that when you're talking about 12 strings, it's extra important that it fits you well and that it's set up right. Otherwise, the 12er stays in the closet.

Now, that said, I'm not sure there's any Guild 12 string that I'd steer you away from, John. Why not look at an old F-112 or F-212 (not the XL) as an introduction. Those guitars are simply wonderful. However, if you're trying for a jumbo (and again, I won't talk you out of that), then boy I do love the F-212XL. The New Hartford "Standard" series version of it is great too. Anyway, all years... it's a really wonderful model. But don't close yourself off from the JF-30-12, which was the less blingy version of the (yes, maple) F-412... I know you might have your mind against a maple guitar, but Guild's arched-back maple is "not your daddy's Buick" if you know what I mean. :)

If I'm being honest, my least favorite Guild 12 string is my G-312 (which is essentially a 12 string version of the D-50). I've never bonded all that much with it. I have played the GAD version of the D-25-12, and that was awfully nice. If you can get your hands on one of those, give it a whirl.

Anyway, enjoy the hunt, John. 12 stringers are a special kind of passion, and it's very hard for me to respond to what you've asked even though I understand exactly what you described as your situation.
 

Grassdog

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If you're open to the import models (formerly GAD series now called the Westerly collection), you may want to check out the F-1512. This is the model with Rosewood back/sides (the F-2512 is maple). I recently bought one of these and I love it. It's been about 3 months and we're still in the honeymoon phase. I wasn't even in the market for a 12 string but I happened to be in at Sam Ash one weekday evening (when it was quiet) and I pulled one off the wall never really expecting to be impressed. After a few minutes, I just had to have it.
 

Rayk

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Personally for the most part it’s a mind game .
If you can get over the notion of the 512 then others will come to the surface .

If your not 12 string bonded then there’s many that will sound good for you.

I would love a 512 but my 212 is fantastic before that my Luna trinity 12 was and before that my Yamaha 312 was .

So if can’t afford one no worries get the best of the ones you can and you’ll bond with it the same way as any other guitar . :)
 

txbumper57

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If you can't afford a F512 I second the notion to take a look for a New Hartford F212XL Standard series. While it is not in the same league Visually as the F512 I would definitely put it in the same league with the tone and play ability it has. They are extremely high quality instruments that in the real world should cost 3 times as much as they go for used based on tone alone. I am sure that Cougar will be along shortly as he just went down this path with a new Martin Hog 12 string and a New Hartford F212XL. Best of luck and I hope this info helps you man. 12 strings are awesome even if you play them like a 6 stringer!

As far as my Jumbo 12 string Guild Food Chain goes, The Apex Predator is the F612 which sounds like you are playing 2 F512's in Stereo, Next is the F512's and extremely close behind that is the F212Xl Standard. Some days I prefer the F212XL cause I am just in a Hog Mood.

TX
 
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Brad Little

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I would characterize the difference between my F-212 and F-512 this way: the 212 growls and the 512 sings. Of course, this is subjective. How much of the difference is due to the 45 year age difference and all those years I bonded with the 212 is hard to assess. I don't remember if I've ever played a 312, but you might consider one, I've occasionally seen them for a reasonable price. I wouldn't dismiss an F-412 out of hand. My F-50 is its 6 string sibling, and I don't find it more jangly than my non-maple guitars, I would say it has more fundamentals and less overtones. I've also heard that maple guitars are better for some recording and performing situations.
Just MHO,
Brad
 

JohnW63

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I guess I need to make a Guild 12 string spreadsheet to keep all the specs clear. I was thinking the period of renaming the darn things would make essentially the same high end guitar sell for less, just because people don't know what it is.

I'll put the NH 212XL on my hit list.
 

JohnW63

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mavuser

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I have owned a total of 4 Guild 12 strings, 3 of which I still own, and played one or 2 others. best bang for the buck is without question the Westerly F-112, and there is no shoratge of them either. I really like the Westerly G-312 as well, and you can find a reasonable deal on these, and the G-212 as well. But the G-312 is a little heavy if u play standing (never played a G-212). I would say the F-112 and F-212 probably sound similar, and the size is more about preferred dimensions/feel than drastically different tone (but ive never played an F-212). there is a nasty video of Bluesypicky dominating a 212 lets see if we can find it.

I did find the video, and it turns out his F-212 is from 1975, same year as my F-112, which is the best sounding one i have personally played. so at the end of the day, for the tone and the money I am recommending the 1975 F-112 and/or F-212 or as close to that as u can get. i do believe there were some chnages in 1976 but there have been holy grail reports from that generation as well (see other thread "F-112 questions").



Also I played Twocorgis' New Hartford F-512, and do concede the tone from that thing was everything it claims to be and more. i missed the boat on getting one at a good price though, and honestly, the guitar is just too big for me. my 1980 G-312 that was in the case its whole life, and its newish strings, are mellowing out a bit, and at the same time im teaching myself how to play it. every night it sounds and sings a little bit more like Twocorgis jewel (still about 50 times heavier, however), and I am so happy to experience his guitar for 30 seconds, just to know what mine should sound like and what I should be trying to make it sound like. Mine is heavier and a little louder, but the dread shape just works better for me. and it is gorgeous. i got lucky and mine has dot inlays (instead of none at all), and it was a fraction of the price of *any F-512, as well as any F-312...so don't sleep on those either, if it's RW your after.
 

mavuser

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u could also get an archback D-25-12/D-212 or a D-4-12, just listen to any big Tom Petty acoustic hit (yer so bad, free fallin...), simlar to the F-112-212 tones for sure. there is also the mahogany top arch back D-15-12/D-17-12 (possibly a 16, not sure of there are 12s of that) of which i flirted with the idea on reverb for a minute, but the time wasnt right for those. all of these are affordable when they pop up, but they sell fast. and the cat may be out of the bag, or at least creeping.
 

mavuser

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i just read this whole thread and see u want an F-212XL from NH. that would be killer to score something close to new like that. Also though, I really liked that F-212XL with the 512 fretbaord/headstock/neck that was floating around from Guitar Center and those crazy stories about its journeys, mis-identification, and mis-representation. there was some wierd mojo with all of that, and it clearly has some other stories to tell, that will never be told...maybe you should check and see if that thing is still up for grabs, one way or another? someone needs to make it right with that thing. I liked that one from the beginning, it's just too big for me.
fyi: http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/showthread.php?195339-NGD-yes-no-maybe-1973-F-212
 

Cougar

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Lots of folks here with much more experience with Guild 12s than me. Nevertheless, I just acquired a jumbo New Hartford F212XLCE. Can't go wrong with one of those! Here's a raw clip of that baby.

But that mint JF30-12 you linked to on reverb looks pretty darn good. It's a 1988, so no ebony fretboard, and I'd want to see a good pic of the saddle. Mine is from a few years later, out of Corona, and I'm thinking it's still my main ax, even better than the 212, which is really saying something! Here's a clip of the JF30-12 that's more processed, but unfinished - still working on the vocal part. :blushed:

That's the extent of my familiarity. Rosewood, mahogany, arch-back maple... I don't 'think it really matters that much. They're all fantastic.

My exceptional JF30-12....

gfj350.jpg
 

Cougar

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But that mint JF30-12 you linked to on reverb looks pretty darn good.

BTW, if you go for that, I'd offer a couple hundred less, at least to start off. I admit I got a fantastic deal on mine, and it was even less than $900.
 

beecee

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Cougar every time I see your guitar I wish mine were a burst!! Just a stunner!! And it looks like a primo spruce top...looks like a lot of silking on that beauty.
 

Cougar

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Cougar every time I see your guitar I wish mine were a burst!! Just a stunner!! And it looks like a primo spruce top...looks like a lot of silking on that beauty.

Thanks, beecee! I'm collecting on some good karma or something because I've had a lot of super good luck in my guitar acquisitions. Of course, that Martin GPC12PA4 I picked up recently is nothing to write home about, and I'll probably be selling that one, still....

Yeah, totally lucky with that JF30-12. Very silky top. I did drive to San Clemente, CA from Salt Lake, UT to pick it up, but, well, I was going to SoCal anyway. :) I looked her over for about 2 minutes and handed over the cash!
 

JohnW63

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This one sold out of their shop, yesterday:
https://reverb.com/item/10406409-guild-f212xl-12-string-guitar-1979

This one has me reconsidering working with the seller:
https://reverb.com/item/8032832-guild-12-string

I ask how the neck angle was and how much saddle was left. It's a 12 string that is 30 years old, after all. Here is what I got back..
First I need to know if you are also known Husband Hound or acting on his behalf?
As to the neck, the angle is fine and so is the saddle, at least in my opinion. I think the action is excellent in general and way beyond that for a 12 string. Here are 4 pictures I just took that will give you an idea.
I will tell you I am not willing to sell for less than the amount shown so if you don't want to pay that price we should each move on. I have all the time in the world to sell and will eventually get my price either here or somewhere else. it happened on the last five things I sold and it will happen with this too. In the meantime I challenge anyone to find a Westerly made Guild in this condition and vintage at this price.
Hope this helpful.

And he included some pretty useless pictures that were not focused on the guitar our so over bright, you could see what he was measuring.
 

JohnW63

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Thanks for the sound clips, Cougar. Things like that help. I should come up with a 12 string tune and post it. I have a 12 string. It just isn't a Guild. I'm debating on whether I really need a second one. If I do, it needs to sound demonstrably better than what I have.
 
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