New to the forums....

Gamehenge757

Junior Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2018
Messages
25
Reaction score
0
But not new to guilds. I’ve had a d4nt, a f4ce-nt, and several GAD series.
I just picked up a GAD40ce-atb for 400, original case, in just about mint condition, and was wondering if that value is on par for market or if I actually got a good deal?

Also I’ve been keeping an eye out for a decent f65. But lately the f47ce’s have been catching my eye, both versions, one is a bit smaller body with a very sharp cutaway and the other has the rounded edge on the cutaway. I was looking for opinions from the masters on those two variations of the f47 as to which is a better guitfiddle?

Thanks for reading my lengthy post!
Thanks in advance for any advice!
And thanks for having me!
 

bayoubengal1954

Junior Member
Joined
Feb 20, 2018
Messages
59
Reaction score
0
Location
New Orleans
Welcome! I am brand new myself and unfortunately don't have the answer to your question, but I can assure you will meet some gracious folks who will be able to help you.

They have already helped me quite a bit!
 

geoguy

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2009
Messages
3,519
Reaction score
1,640
Location
metrowest MA
Welcome, Gamehenge . . . in my opinion you got a very good deal on that guitar. Some might say that you stole it!

Also in my opinion, the F47 is a very fine, albeit slightly under-the-radar Guild guitar. I don't know what else might be different about those variations other than the two different flavors of cutaway, though I'm partial to sharp (Florentine) cutaways in general.

I do know that there was a GSR (Guild Special Run) version of the F47 with koa back/sides, and that one had a Florentine cutaway. Probably only about 20 of those were built, so they are somewhat rare.
 

geoguy

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2009
Messages
3,519
Reaction score
1,640
Location
metrowest MA
Just found a clip of a F47MC with a Florentine cutaway. The "M" in the model name refers to maple back/sides:

 

Gamehenge757

Junior Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2018
Messages
25
Reaction score
0
Yeah that’s close to the one I’m looking at. Very sharp looking guitar. Wish I could get my hands on one to give it a whirl. Played the other style f47, in mahogany, and it was superb
 

killdeer43

Reverential Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2008
Messages
21,848
Reaction score
111
Location
Northwest Washington on the Salish Sea
WELCOME TO LTG!

I can tell that you're new if you think your post was lengthy...stick around and wait for Al to chime in on Monday. :biggrin-new:

Congrats on your new acquisition and keep us posted,
Joe
 

adorshki

Reverential Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2009
Messages
34,176
Reaction score
6,789
Location
Sillycon Valley CA
WELCOME TO LTG!

I can tell that you're new if you think your post was lengthy...stick around and wait for Al to chime in on Monday. :biggrin-new:

Joe
Started to answer this yesterday but had to postpone it.
Welcome Gamehenge, I am notorious for taking weekends off and then reviving threads on Monday mornings...but although I'm an F40 lover based on my F65ce experience (same family, just like your F4ce and its "cutaway electric" variants, I can't help you regarding which body wood might render the best gitfiddle...I CAN tell you that the bodies should all be 16" lower bout jumbo shape (original F40 spec), so there shouldn't really be an appreciable size difference between Florentine or Venetian cutaway, but I can't recall if New Hartford might have increased the lower bout diameter by a fraction (1/8" or 1/4")
Body depth also ranged between 4-7/8" -5" depending on build year and specific model.
I think the real question is actually going to be whether you have a preference for tonal characteristics of maple (F47M) or mahogany (F47) in flat back form.
Original F40's were maple archbacks, original F47's replaced 'em with flat 'hog backs, and then were "Re-invented" in early '90s with choice of 3 body woods and cutaway and electronics, and included rosewood flatback version (F47rce) as well.
Those options persisted up through new Hartford production in 2014, "if I recall correctly", although I don't remember if they offered the "R" version in Tacoma.
One thing to watch for in Corona and Tacoma instruments is the presence of a bar code sticker with a new s/n indicating a refurbished instrument.
While the guitars may actually have had nothing wrong with 'em, that refurbished brand puts a hit on value, so check with us here if you've got any doubts.
And that's the "short version"...
:glee:
 

mavuser

Enlightened Member
Joined
Sep 15, 2010
Messages
8,128
Reaction score
2,636
Location
New York
welcome to our guitar forum, Gamehenge! Big Red would approve!!
 

gjmalcyon

Senior Member
Gold Supporting
Joined
Feb 6, 2011
Messages
4,179
Reaction score
2,417
Location
Gloucester County, NJ
Guild Total
13
Those options persisted up through new Hartford production in 2014, "if I recall correctly", although I don't remember if they offered the "R" version in Tacoma.

They did offer the F-47R from Tacoma. I've got one and I love the sound and smaller body size.

Here's a shot of the back of my F-47R from our recent "show us your backs!" thread.

And welcome!

IHQlNeh.jpg
 
Last edited:

txbumper57

Enlightened Member
Joined
Sep 6, 2014
Messages
7,577
Reaction score
58
Location
Texas
Welcome Gamehenge757. Just to clarify there is a considerable difference in the build characteristics and body shapes of the 2 F47's you mentioned looking at. The one with the rounded cutaway which was made in Westerly , R.I. and Corona, Ca. is actually considered to be a "Mini Jumbo" Body shape while the ones with the Sharp cutaway which were made in Tacoma and New Hartford had body designs based off of the original late 50's models with a more narrow waist. Completely different dimensions and shapes on the two models. Also the rounded cutaway models had mostly Sitka Spruce tops with Sitka bracing while the later Sharp cutaway models mostly sported Adirondack Spruce tops with Scalloped Adirondack bracing. The Sitka will have a warmer tone to it while the Adirondack will have a louder more focused tone to it. I have seen Rosewood and Mahogany variations of the rounded cutaway models with possibly maple as well but not sure about that. I know for sure the regular production models with the sharper cutaway were offered in Maple and Rosewood with that special run mentioned of 20 or so guitars made with Koa. Hope that info helps and I am sure others will be along shortly to ad more info. Ralf should have a lot of the specs on the two different models If I recall correctly so hopefully he will jump in with details shortly. Have a good one and look forward to hearing more from you soon!

TX
 

adorshki

Reverential Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2009
Messages
34,176
Reaction score
6,789
Location
Sillycon Valley CA
The one with the rounded cutaway which was made in Westerly , R.I. and Corona, Ca. is actually considered to be a "Mini Jumbo" Body shape while the ones with the Sharp cutaway which were made in Tacoma and New Hartford had body designs based off of the original late 50's models with a more narrow waist. Completely different dimensions and shapes on the two models.

Tx this might be a matter of semantics, but I wouldn't call 'em "completely different" dimensions and shapes, 'cause I think they'll both fit inside each other's cases:
1975 (your "Mini Jumbo", 16" lower bout):
s-l225.jpg

2013 ("original late '50's" 16" +/- ? lower bout):
s-l225.jpg
 

dreadnut

Gone But Not Forgotten
Gone But Not Forgotten
Joined
Jun 15, 2005
Messages
16,082
Reaction score
6,442
Location
Grand Rapids, MI
Guild Total
2
Welcome! You've been officially approved by our membership committee!

wKrKVx7.jpg
 

txbumper57

Enlightened Member
Joined
Sep 6, 2014
Messages
7,577
Reaction score
58
Location
Texas
Tx this might be a matter of semantics, but I wouldn't call 'em "completely different" dimensions and shapes, 'cause I think they'll both fit inside each other's cases:
1975 (your "Mini Jumbo", 16" lower bout):
s-l225.jpg

2013 ("original late '50's" 16" +/- ? lower bout):
s-l225.jpg

Al I am not going to argue with you but the shape of a Late Westerly/Corona F47CE is somewhat different from the 70's model you have pictured. Here is a photo for you to compare the differences from the late Westerly model to the photo of the later Tacoma and New Hartford version. Coming from someone who owns a 2003 F47BRZ based on the Westerly/Corona shape and dimensions I can tell you first hand they are considerably different. The New Hartford model would have good bit of wiggle room in the Corona/Westerly case especially in the upper bout and waist areas.

Straight for westerlyguildguitars.com

F47CE

f47cehg.jpg


Tacoma/New Hartford F47CE Body shape.
traditional_series_mainimage_f-47mc_w-dtar-1500x630.jpg


1999 Westerly F47CE body shape
wq3cmdmdnyfwgjbekmmc.jpg


TX
 

Gamehenge757

Junior Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2018
Messages
25
Reaction score
0
Wow guys thanks for the warm welcome and all the responses!!! I’d love to see a rosewood f47, all my previous guilds have been ‘hogs, but I’ve loved the sound of the d-50s and d-55’s my whole life, i imagine a f47 in rosewood would sound huge.
Have to admit i do like the look of the classic one a big more, but the changes in tonewoods on the newer versions make me think I need to seek one out to play it. I’m a fingerpicker mostly, and a little focus in the tone couldn’t hurt on some lead runs
 

mavuser

Enlightened Member
Joined
Sep 15, 2010
Messages
8,128
Reaction score
2,636
Location
New York
Gamehenge, I would hold out for the rosewood F-47 from Tacoma/ New Hartford, for a few differnt reasons, but the big one for me is the traditional ("paddle") headstock that the other ones pictured do not have (those have the "snake head"). nothing wrong with any of them but if both are available go for the paddle,, Trey would approve this message! especially the RW
good luck!
 

adorshki

Reverential Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2009
Messages
34,176
Reaction score
6,789
Location
Sillycon Valley CA
I’d love to see a rosewood f47, all my previous guilds have been ‘hogs, but I’ve loved the sound of the d-50s and d-55’s my whole life, i imagine a f47 in rosewood would sound huge.
Have to admit i do like the look of the classic one a big more, but the changes in tonewoods on the newer versions make me think I need to seek one out to play it. I’m a fingerpicker mostly, and a little focus in the tone couldn’t hurt on some lead runs
To be clear the did also offer the F47rce out of very late Westerly, would look just like the "F47ce" Txbumper posted, but they're pretty uncommon.
The adi tops on 'em didn't appear until New Hartford though.
And we both could have picked better pics to illustrate the "outline" differences, example of original F40 outline was revived in the Nashville Custom Shop in '97:
valencia.JPG

F47's replaced F40's in the line in '64, they were flat-back hog-body versions of F40's.
Then F40's were "refreshed" under George Gruhn with his F44/F46 designs in '84, I think that ushered in the "mini-jumbo" shape TX references.
Bear in mind your F4ce IS one evolutionary branch of the F40, just like same era F47's, itself derived from the F40, as spelled out here:
http://www.westerlyguildguitars.com/guitars/f4ce.html
But F47's always had the 4-7/8 to 5" body depth:
http://www.westerlyguildguitars.com/guitars/f47rce.html
The cutaways on 'em first appeared as "F45ce" in late '80's and that was actually a shortscale instrument and is what I'm currently lusting after.
Admittedly I was unaware of the outline changes to F47's in Tacoma, the model was under my radar at the time.
Only recently did I realize how much I love that 16" lower bout F body based on my experience with my F65ce (maple archback version of F4ce).
:friendly_wink:
 

JohnW63

Enlightened Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2012
Messages
6,293
Reaction score
2,216
Location
Southern California
Guild Total
4
Yes, but what STRINGS should they be played with ?

( Hides under a pile of throw pillows and a Guild guitar shipping box to wait for the fireworks . )
 
Top