Guild's Heyday years...

Westerly Wood

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A friend asked me last night, since he is confident of Gibson's demise, thus turning his attention to a possible Guild flattop purchase, "when was Guild's heyday?"

Like Martin struggled in 70s, Gibson is ever wildly inconsistent re quality, but re Guild, I said late 60s, the whole 70s and early 80s, a stretch of the 90's, NH....seems like a wide range of great decades. But it is possible Guild has had less QC issues vs the other mfgers? I don't remember.

If he is looking on reverb and ebay etc, what decades does one target for Guild greatness? I mean, I am biased to Hoboken and Westerly, so I want to give the man some more runway than just my own sku'd preference :). (which is just one of the myriad of reasons i would have been the worst politician)...

thanks
 
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Rayk

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Geese that’s a open sky question lol is it being asked from a tonal perspective or a sales and stability perspective ?

Al ! Haha
 

Westerly Wood

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every guitar mfger has its heydy, i think Guild's is longer. just seeking input.

w
 

The Guilds of Grot

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It is generally considered that Guild never had a "bad" period of manufacturing although some people are not fond of the Corona instruments. As to a "Heyday", people claim the the late 90's at Westerly after the purchase by Fender. Rumor is Fender brought a more thorough QC system and the whole of production improved. Others claim it all went down hill once they moved from Hoboken. Others will argue the same of NYC.

How's that for a definitive answer?
 

Westerly Wood

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It is generally considered that Guild never had a "bad" period of manufacturing although some people are not fond of the Corona instruments. As to a "Heyday", people claim the the late 90's at Westerly after the purchase by Fender. Rumor is Fender brought a more thorough QC system and the whole of production improved. Others claim it all went down hill once they moved from Hoboken. Others will argue the same of NYC.

How's that for a definitive answer?

that is a great answer Grot, thanks. so basically, not bad period :)

w
 

Br1ck

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I tend to go by my very limited experience. I've never played a Hoboken Guild. I've played quite a few 70s Westerlys. I own a 70 D 35, and played four or five 70-74 guitars, D 25s, and D 35s mostly and a handful from 78 to mid 80s. I much prefer the early 70s as they were built lighter, but as a consequence either had or needed neck resets. The late ones are heavier, but certainly never have I played any true dogs, unlike Gibsons. 70s Gibsons are all over the place.

A good friend has a 77 F 112 that is sweet, so somewhat contradicts the above. I had a late 80s F 40 that was just OK, but far better than the Ibanez it replaced. I've heard a Tacoma F 412 that sounded really good, and played a New Hartford D 55 that blew away every Martin dread in the store.

I think I'd shop pre 74 or New Hartford if I were looking. I'd need to play anything else to be comfortable. I also generally prefer the flatback, but that is very subjective.
 

geoguy

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Tacoma also put out some fine guitars (ignoring the goofy neck-attachment gizmo issue on one or two models). I can vouch for a Tacoma D-55 & F-412 in particular.

For Westerly Wood's buddy, I'd probably suggest New Hartford, Tacoma, & Westerly. New Hartford first for lightness of build & overall quality (as well as less likelihood of repairs being needed). Westerly last only because some guitars produced there are more likely to need major attention (refretting, neck reset) simply due to their age.
 

Westerly Wood

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Tacoma also put out some fine guitars (ignoring the goofy neck-attachment gizmo issue on one or two models). I can vouch for a Tacoma D-55 & F-412 in particular.

For Westerly Wood's buddy, I'd probably suggest New Hartford, Tacoma, & Westerly. New Hartford first for lightness of build & overall quality (as well as less likelihood of repairs being needed). Westerly last only because some guitars produced there are more likely to need major attention (refretting, neck reset) simply due to their age.

thanks Geo. this helps!
 

Nuuska

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Hello

My -75 F50R, -77 F512 & -79 F212CSB never needed any work up to this date - and they have been in very dry winters and very humid summers here. All three still in great shape.
 

adorshki

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Rumor is Fender brought a more thorough QC system and the whole of production improved.
I assume you're using the term "rumor" casually, but for clarity for folks who may take the term literally, in fact that was explicitly stated by member Hideglue (who was there) many years ago.
The confusion is about whether the guitars were better or just more stringently QC'd because he said "Guild QC reached a zenith under Fender".
That caused some push-back and he had to clarify that what he meant was the QC process became more stringent: Fender instituted checklists to ensure no step was missed, not that the guitars were inherently any better.
Others claim it all went down hill once they moved from Hoboken. Others will argue the same of NYC.

How's that for a definitive answer?
LOL, yep.

As for Corona when I first joined they weren't gettin' no respect, and at least part of that was because Fender released so much unsold inventory to market through MIRC when they closed, and none of it had warranty.
Even I was kind of surprised that my ("A" stock) D40 was the sonic runt of the litter, before I ever joined her and found out what happened.
For the first few years I was here Corona definitely had the highest percentage of new owner disappointment, around 15% based on my informal mental tally.
Even that's a lot lower than what seems to be reported for Martin and Gibson, although I don't hang around on those forums, just going by comments made by members here who do.
But around the same time I started noticing my D40 was finally finding a voice, we also started seeing a very high satisfaction percentage of buyers of Corona "A" stock and even MIRC's (See Cougar's JF30-12 and Retro Rocker's F50 for example) , coinciding with an observation Fender's CEO during Corona made in an interview: He thought guitars hit their high point at around 10-15 years old.
IIRC that was Larry Thomas' son but I couldn't find the interview last time I looked. It just always stuck with though, because my D4-0 was proving it out.
Build wise Coronas have a "built like a tank" rep but fit and finish is every bit as good as my Westerlys, and finish is even better.
Generally speaking, for your friend, it's been said her many times that sure GUild has a dud once in awhile but no "bad periods", that the overall percentage of great guitars to merely good or duds is much higher than "the other guys".
I think it's due to the lower output allowing 'em to pay more attention to each piece, and the fact that in Westerly a least, it was normal for folks at workstations to vet the work of the last station and send a piece back for rework if needed.
There was just a higher level of actual hand-bulding involved.
's why they got soul.
:friendly_wink:

I'd suggest something from "late Westerly" ('96-'01, "Fender era") forward for reasons of likely having a good long life before repairs are needed, and Corona in particular may be a very good bang for the buck simply because the market still undervalues 'em.
But watch out for MIRC pieces being advertised for "A" stock pricing.
They'll always have that barcode sticker over the s/n on the label
 
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fronobulax

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The question assumes a consistency in model names, numbers and specifications that Guild never had. That is frustrating as anyone who has ever hunted for, for example, a Guild F-30 knows. You really should take the opportunity to have the friend join LTG, tell us what they think they like or want and go for there. I mean, do people really think finding a Guild should be as easy as finding a Martin? :)

If you want something specific, start with New Hartford. They are new enough that no one should be talking "neck reset" and for the most part the factory produced a consistent product.

(In a side reference to another thread, I find it interesting that you or your friend implicitly limited the discussion to used instruments).
 

Westerly Wood

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(In a side reference to another thread, I find it interesting that you or your friend implicitly limited the discussion to used instruments).

Oh that is my doing, that is my default mindset re cars and guitars. 😀

Thanks everyone for thoughts on the period. Seems like every period is worth considering. That is so Guild.

While I be partial to pre 74, others like end of Westerly years, then NH is considered a crowning achievement by most, even Corona and Tacoma.
 

adorshki

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Oh that is my doing, that is my default mindset re cars and guitars. ��

Thanks everyone for thoughts on the period. Seems like every period is worth considering. That is so Guild.

While I be partial to pre 74, others like end of Westerly years, then NH is considered a crowning achievement by most, even Corona and Tacoma.

"Pretty much".
Westerly had and still has a halo reputation probably because they were the single longest running location, but 10 years ago you'd see "pre-Fender" ironically and idiotically being used as a laudatory term for late Westerlys being listed, and Coronas were what happened "after Fender ruined 'em".
You still see the Westerly halo popping up in ads, and when I joined I was a late Westerly loyalist.
But I'm open-minded about Tacoma Nd NH due to all the positive revues here, and would really like to get my hands on some samples of each some day.
I'm willing to accept that NH might just have out-built my beloved Westerly based on reviews from owners of both.
 

Westerly Wood

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"Pretty much".
Westerly had and still has a halo reputation probably because they were the single longest running location, but 10 years ago you'd see "pre-Fender" ironically and idiotically being used as a laudatory term for late Westerlys being listed, and Coronas were what happened "after Fender ruined 'em".
You still see the Westerly halo popping up in ads, and when I joined I was a late Westerly loyalist.
But I'm open-minded about Tacoma Nd NH due to all the positive revues here, and would really like to get my hands on some samples of each some day.
I'm willing to accept that NH might just have out-built my beloved Westerly based on reviews from owners of both.

Yeah Al. Sounds like NH wins in a shootout most days here. My partiality to Westerly is due to my Rhode Island roots and they are affordable guitars. I can spend 600-800 and get a quality built acoustic dread with loads of mojo. That is hard to beat.
 

Cypress Knee

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To me Guild's heyday years were in the late '60's/early '70's when a number of notable artists where photographed playing their personal Guilds in performance situations - most notable Tommy Smothers, John Denver, Richie Havens, Nick Drake, Dave Van Ronk, Duane Eddy, and Mississippi John Hurt. Guild was their guitar of choice, while other big name performers may have played Guild (Clapton, Paul Simon, etc) it is not the brand that they are associated with. Heck, that list even has particular models associated with the musicians - D-55, F50R Artist & F 612, D-40, M-20, F-50, DE 400, and F-30.

The workmanship periods at Guild may have been better at certain times and locations, but the artist heyday was certainly 1970, give or take a few years either direction.

Just my .02 on this subject, FWIW.

CK
 
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chazmo

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I'll ditto what Grot said. We really don't have a "bad" period to avoid in Guild history. There have been some bumps along the way, such as the rash of bad reclaimed Tacoma-built Contemporaries that were dumped on the market when they were closed... And, while no bad era exists, I'm not sure there's a "heyday" either.

Personally, I remain awed by the bravery of experimentation that came out of Hoboken and early Westerly. Some really fascinating and desirable guitars were born during that era. We started seeing a lot of that spirit again in New Hartford a few years ago, and I feel a real affection for the NH era, a lot of which is probably wrapped up in the fact that I got to know a bunch of the folks that built 'em and ran the facility. And, just to muddy the waters even further, the guitar that rules the roost at my house is a Tacoma-era F-512. It's the reason why I got into Guild in the first place. A total "Maxell" moment in the store (multiple times) before I ended up bringing it home.
 

chazmo

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Yeah Al. Sounds like NH wins in a shootout most days here. My partiality to Westerly is due to my Rhode Island roots and they are affordable guitars. I can spend 600-800 and get a quality built acoustic dread with loads of mojo. That is hard to beat.

Sadly, Wood, I would like to point out that many of the die-hard Westerly fans here (LTGers, I mean) have lost interest in Guild over time (for a variety of reasons) and we don't hear from them often anymore.
 

Westerly Wood

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Sadly, Wood, I would like to point out that many of the die-hard Westerly fans here (LTGers, I mean) have lost interest in Guild over time (for a variety of reasons) and we don't hear from them often anymore.

i cannot blame them for walking away when Westerly was shut down. After 30 odd years, that had to be painful to see that go.
I know of one guitar shop in Providence that literally turned its back from Guild when that happened. like they were just to bummed to continue on with Guild. I just wish I had known about Guild and Westerly when I was a kid. When my folks wanted to buy me a guitar, I could have said, "well Mom, let's take a drive down to Westerly and check out Guild..." That would have been awesome. I might have started it all off with a D25 or something like that since age 13 instead of 30 years later :).
 

chazmo

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Well, you might've driven down there, but they wouldn't've let you in. :) I don't know, maybe, but I don't recall hearing anything here about such things except, of course, for certain artists... There were no public tours of the factory or anything to my knowledge during the Fender era, and probably before that too. And, as recently as New Hartford, even, I don't think Guilds were ever sold out of the shop. There are probably some exceptions -- notably the factory second sale that we had at LMG4.

This all kind of shocked me in 2009 when I started nagging New Hartford managers to let us come visit. Taylor had totally re-invented the business from a customer service and "openness" point of view, and I couldn't believe how closed off Guild was. Anyway, it was fun to break down those walls in New Hartford.
 
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