Tell me about the Guild Arcos Series

PittPastor

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The search goes on. Saw a Guild Arcos Series AO-3CE on Reverb. Price seems amazingly cheap.

The arched back design intrigues me. Would prefer to be able to get it at GC for the worry free return option, but the price on Reverb is low enough that I might be able to risk it. It is a refurb model (never played according to ad) I worry about that. My understanding is that it could be no big reason as to why it was in refurb, or could be something major, so that is worrying a little.

It has a bolt-on neck. After reading Ray's horror story with the CV-1, that doesn't make me feel great. I know this was during the Fender period, but actually everything I read about the MIM Guilds seems to be favorable, and the guys who bought them (at least that I can tell) seem to really like them.

Anyone have any opinions on them they can share?
 

InvisibleWren

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I played a few Arcos dreads in a local store back when they came out. I thought they played and sounded great, but the shop sent about six of them back to the manufacturer because necks hadn't been dried out properly and when they hit the dry air of Idaho... well bad things happened. If they're still playable now and you can keep it humidified, they're really great sounding guitars. I'm cautious about that series now though.
 

PittPastor

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I played a few Arcos dreads in a local store back when they came out. I thought they played and sounded great, but the shop sent about six of them back to the manufacturer because necks hadn't been dried out properly and when they hit the dry air of Idaho... well bad things happened. If they're still playable now and you can keep it humidified, they're really great sounding guitars. I'm cautious about that series now though.

Yikes. That is the kind of thing that not having a return policy like GC scares me...

Also, would that be something that would show up in a picture? Or is it only noticeable when playing?
 
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Rayk

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Don’t let the term bolt on neck become a negitive factor . My Wilborn custom is bolt on lots of high end builders are going to this type of neck mounting . :)
 

chazmo

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PittPastor,

Also, in case you didn't already know, the Arcos were built in Ensenada, Mexico. If I recall right, "Arcos" was presumed by us to have something to do with the arched-back products.

I never had a chance to play any Arcos, but I did spend time with MIM DV-4 and DV-6 models which preceded the Arcos. I had very mixed feelings about those DVs at the time.

Anyway, I'd say that if you find one that is in good, playable shape, you should be comfortable getting one. The bolt-on neck thing was only really an issue for Guild with the Tacoma-built Contemporary series, which had a unique neck block system... To my knowledge that wasn't used on the Arcos, but I'm not sure about that.
 

fronobulax

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My local dealer could not keep Arcos models in stock. They would sell almost as soon as they went on display. That was in contrast to the MIC Guilds that stayed on the wall for months. He said he personally thought the Arcos were a better bang for the (new) buck but also noted that the D.C. suburbs were an "interesting" guitar market and what sold for him was different from what sold, or didn't, 50 miles out.

In general, bolt on necks are nothing to fear and are perhaps unfairly associated with "low quality". Look at a bolt on neck as your insurance policy that gives you a cheaper neck reset when necessary. The Tacoma Contemporary Series did have some issues but they were because of a technology innovation that was not always properly executed.

Refurb sounds scary, but it isn't. Many refurbs are done on instruments that went from the factory to the refurb company and then to the sales channel. In many cases the factory won't release the instruments unless the refurb agrees to meet certain standards. Even when the manufacturer doesn't demand it, most refurb companies have standards and will bring every instrument up to those standards. I don't have stats about what work is done in refurbs but there a lot of anecdotes about cosmetic, not functional, fixes (because the guitar already functioned as designed) or trivial things like pickup screws not being tight so there was a rattle.

Don't miss an opportunity because you are fixated on how easy returns are at GC. And there are a few stories on LTG where the GC return policy did not work the way people expected... (Someone got burned because there was a 30 day window on used but a 7 day window on vintage and there was a misunderstanding about whether the instrument was used or vintage. Also think someone got hit by an unexpected transfer/shipping/restocking fee. Also think these stories may be years old so might not apply to Today's GC).
 

Bill Ashton

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I agree with Chazmo about the latter day DV guitars...they were "lacking" something. Cannot remember if they were Tacoma's or Mexcian.

Bolt on necks seem to have become a thing for "purists," or dare I say it "cork sniffers?" For them, even Martins "post and tenon" attachment isn't proper, only dovetail will do :chargrined:

Collings guitars have bolt on necks. Huss and Dalton as well. Like 'em or not, Taylor has sold millions of them, no worries with a neck set there!
 

davismanLV

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Pretty much what chazmo, frono, and Bill have said covers my opinion. Only my two older Guilds have a glued, dovetailed neck joint..... all the others are bolt ons, and that's just FINE with me. Most refurbs go through a company like MIRC (musical instrument reclamation corporation) and they do a great job getting these guitars ready for sale. Sometimes it's a finish flaw, and sometimes something more severe but they make them right and then sell them to dealers at a greatly reduced price. The label should say who did the refurb and will be over the original Guild label. Anyway, I think those MIM guitars are good. Not played one but everyone I've heard about said they were an amazing value.
 

SFIV1967

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Here's a bit of history about the Arcos line:

As chazmo already mentioned, "Arcos" is Spanish for "arches" (since they were made at FMIC/Guild in Ensenada/Mexico) and is referring to the arched back of the Arcos series.

The Guild Arcos series was first introduced at NAMM 2012.
Here's the first 2012 press release: http://guildguitars.com/guild-introduces-new-arcos-series-acoustics/
37 pictures of the former factory can be seen here: https://www.guitarworld.com/features/fender-mexico-turns-25-factory-photo-tour

There were initially 3 Arcos models (AD-3, AD-3CE and AO-3CE) featuring laminated mahogany sides and arched back with a solid sitka spruce top.

In 2013 two more models were added, AD-5CE and AO-5CE featuring laminated rosewood sides and arched back.

At NAMM 2014 the AF-50E and AF-50CE were the added jumbo size models and even a bass was added, the AB-52E: http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sh...New-Arcos-Series-AB-52E-Electro-Acoustic-Bass

Also a 12 string version, called "AF-412E" was added!

The last model added in 2014 before production was shut down was the arched laminated rosewood version AF-50RE.
Production of the Arcos line in the FMIC plant in Ensenada stopped when CMG bought Guild from FMIC.

See also here: http://www.letstalkguild.com/ltg/sh...es-Acoustics&p=1503945&viewfull=1#post1503945

AO-3CE:



Ralf
 
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A few years ago I was back in my old stomping grounds, Northern New Jersey. I visited the store where I bought my D40 in 1979. They usually have a few Guilds in the locked display cases.

On this visit there were also some (Arcos) out on a rack and available to play. There was also a row of boxed Guilds out in the open. I asked about them and was told they are getting shipped back to Mexico, Arcos with neck problemos.
 

PittPastor

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On this visit there were also some (Arcos) out on a rack and available to play. There was also a row of boxed Guilds out in the open. I asked about them and was told they are getting shipped back to Mexico, Arcos with neck problemos.

guild-1979-d40: Did they say what the problems were?

SO, here's what happened since I posted this question: I went ahead and pulled the trigger on the MIM Guild:

Guild AO-3CE - Orchestra Cutaway - MIM - Acoustic-Electric Guitar - Natural Finish - With Case

The store policy is that it takes returns within 14 days with a 15% restocking fee. They accepted an offer less than what they were asking, so I figure my risk isn't too high here. Worst case scenario, I am out somewhere between $75 - $100. Not too bad, and nothing is without any risk. Even GC would charge restocking fee. And if it turns out to be a good guitar, I should have a solid 1 3/4" playing guitar for $350. Which I am very happy with. (OK, it's not American. But at least it's North American!)

Then I read all of the people telling me not to worry, and that MIMs are good value, and I'm feeling really good about it... And then comes guild-1979-d40's post which says a few years ago some New Jersey store had some neck issues. Now I'm thinking: Crap! What have I done? This is significant news because (wait for it) The company I'm buying this from is in New Jersey. Yikes.

Well, we'll see what happens. It should be here sometime next week. I'll probably take it to Stuart Day for an evaluation just to feel better.

Thanks all! I'll keep you posted. And I'll put up pics.

And if I end up keeping it, my Guild Mark II will be going up for sale.
 

davismanLV

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Don't fret about problems you don't have yet. Just anticipate and try not to pace. I'll bet it's gonna be a GREAT guitar! Stay calm. :encouragement:
 
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Robbies Music in Wayne, NJ. In more recent years, I haven't seen any new Guilds, just used. As Tom said, I wouldn't worry. I'm due for another visit to NJ and hope to have time to stop into the store. Robbies has been there forever and the upstairs guitar department could use a facelift. They also have a store in Mahwah, NJ.
 

PittPastor

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swiveltung

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IIRC, one of the problems with the Arcos was the wood was not properly aged. Cracks, warps etc.
 

AZLiberty

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They accepted an offer less than what they were asking, so I figure my risk isn't too high here. Worst case scenario, I am out somewhere between $75 - $100. Not too bad, and nothing is without any risk.

Assuming the refurbisher was MIRC, I honestly don't think you have much to worry about. Every refurbed Guild I have ever seen went through MIRC.

MIRC = Music Instrument Reclamation Corp.

Generally these will have a secondary (usually silver) serial number sticker.

I don't actually see anything in the listing saying that it was MIRC that did the refurb though.

Also, I rather like the aesthetics of these, especially the rosette.
 
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PittPastor

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I don't actually see anything in the listing saying that it was MIRC that did the refurb though.
Also, I rather like the aesthetics of these, especially the rosette.

You are absolutely correct. Nothing in the listing states it is MIRC. It hints at it:

This is a never played or owned instrument. This is a Manufacturer Refurbished* item and came through our factory refurbisher. Upon very close inspection we could not find a thing out of place on this instrument, it is Minty Mint. Many of the guitars that come through our refurbisher are merely model closeouts, need a set-up, or have some minor issue. This guitar came into the refurbisher and needed nothing, this is a discontinued model so it is just a closeout on a very successful and well made Guild model.

** Factory Authorized Refurbished by the largest instrument refurbishing center in the US

Not sure who else would qualify as "the largest instrument refurbishing center in the US." But it would be nice if they just came out and said it. Although maybe they can't? IDK.

I should know when I get it tho, right?
 
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