New Member - Question about your setup

Hey all,

Happy to have found this forum!

Question: Does anyone go through a basic setup/change when they get a Guild flat-top? I don't mean you got a vintage and had to do some fixing. I mean, you have a guitar -- old or new -- and the first thing you ALWAYS do is... what? Anything? Neck adjustment? Fret adjustment? Guilds just play great as is...?

Just curious. I have had mine for a very long time and never even thought about taking it somewhere to have it fixed "for me." Mainly because I still don't know what that means!

Thanks!

Welcome.

"Me and my house" have always been of the benign neglect or "It ain't broke so don't fix it" school. Most of our instruments have never been worked on unless there was an obvious problem and the work would address it. But, I have noticed that as my playing improves, what was not a problem years ago is one now. I had a bass that I was quite happy with. I took it to a gathering of LTG friends and two people who played it took me aside and said it needed a neck reset. It turned out that the intonation was horrible about he 7th fret. I never ventured there so did not notice. Better players did. (For the record, my luthier said it did not need a reset and solved the problems with a new bridge). I took my custom bass back to the builder because he asked and he made several neck adjustments because he had expected the wood to "move" in a year and it had. I was quite happy before the change but I am happier after.

That said, several things are almost maintenance items. These include checking/adjusting the truss rod, intonation, action and possibly beidge height and nut depth. Any unusual noise should be checked out - fret buzz, loose braces etc. but if there are no noises...

To answer your question, in our case we don't do anything "for me" unless there is a specific problem we have become aware of. Otherwise "made to be played".

fronobulax said:

Welcome.

"Me and my house" have always been of the benign neglect or "It ain't broke so don't fix it" school. Most of our instruments have never been worked on unless there was an obvious problem and the work would address it. But, I have noticed that as my playing improves, what was not a problem years ago is one now. I had a bass that I was quite happy with. I took it to a gathering of LTG friends and two people who played it took me aside and said it needed a neck reset. It turned out that the intonation was horrible about he 7th fret. I never ventured there so did not notice. Better players did. (For the record, my luthier said it did not need a reset and solved the problems with a new bridge). I took my custom bass back to the builder because he asked and he made several neck adjustments because he had expected the wood to "move" in a year and it had. I was quite happy before the change but I am happier after.

That said, several things are almost maintenance items. These include checking/adjusting the truss rod, intonation, action and possibly beidge height and nut depth. Any unusual noise should be checked out - fret buzz, loose braces etc. but if there are no noises...

To answer your question, in our case we don't do anything "for me" unless there is a specific problem we have become aware of. Otherwise "made to be played".

Click to expand...

+1

The first thing I do is check out the whole Guitar for obvious issues then I look at the action , next adjustment etc . Done like relief in their necks meaning a little curve . I like straight as an arrow .

I like a certain feel and action height in most cases any new/ used guitar I buy needs a slight setup and string change .

My recent Guild was set for me by the store I bought it from and we got lucky because their on the other side of the country haha .

Oh and welcome aboard

Not +1 . . .

Most of the instruments I have have had some luthier work done ranging from very minor bridge/nut work to full neck reset and refret. In recent years, I've sanded saddles, adjusted truss rods, and fixed/replaced tuning machines as a matter of course as very minor setup items. Many of these instruments were purchased used, over the internet, and I have been willing to give them the TLC they need to become "perfect" for me.

I should note that I'm a serious 12-string lover/collector, and I am very sensitive to a proper 12-string setup (for me). I have said this many times here, but it bears repeating... a 12-string that isn't properly set up (for you) is one that will end up in a closet and be neglected. That makes me sad.

Allow me to use this palindromic post to say, WELCOME TO LTG!

When I put my hands on a guitar, whether it's new or just new to me, I certainly inspect it with my eyes, ears, and fingers. As frono alluded, unless there's a specific problem that needs to be "fixed" I just play it. It's easy enough to tell if there's a set-up issue to deal with and then it's luthier time.
My own inspection is usually rigorous enough for me and after all, I'm the owner/player, etc.

To paraphrase Ricky Nelson, you can't please everyone but you've got to please yourself.
:mellow:

Cheers,
Joe

A set-up mainly consists of an overall adjustment of all of the things that when put together, equal the overall "playability" of your guitar. A full set-up would include- where necassary- adjusting the neck relief with the truss rod, sanding the bottom of the saddle, possibly cleaning the nut slots out or in some cases filing them in, leveling the frets (possibly "dressing" or "crowning" the frets), possibly cleaning/lubricating the tuners, new strings, fretboard oiled, clean the guitar...sometimes just one or 2 of those things are necessary. Some guitars just magically seem to require minimal maintenance, or even none at all, over the long term. it depends on a lot of things from your playing style to your choice in strings and tunings, to even the weather. You could have a guitar that is all good to go, but if you have a specific preference like high action for slide or super heavy gauge strings, it may need some set-up/adjustment, to get it perfect for those changes.

one would typically be due for a set up if the action gets higher and the guitar is noticeably harder to play, or if there is "buzz" from the strings hitting the frets, higher than where you are fretting it. Or if the tonation/tuning is off.

chazmo said:

Not +1 . . .
.

Click to expand...

I meant to say +1 to what what frono said as in I agree with what he said , gosh did mess that up too ?

Where were you folks when I was in school ? Haha

I'm not all that picky, likely because I'm not all that great a player. Unless it's basically unplayable I just leave 'em alone. I'm likely in the minority but actually prefer my action to be higher than most others I've talked to or met.

Well, I check the nut slot height, I often adjust the nut slots so that the slot clears the string on the headstock end of the nut. ( I do a funnel shaped slot) I check for neck relief if there is something I dont like about the action.

I do a complete setup on any guitar I buy, new or used.

1) First I check all the frets with a fret rocker. (I use about a 3" long scrap of 1/4" OD ground steel rod.) Any high frets get lowered. Any sharp ends get filed.

2) Second I check the nut slots. With a capo between the second and third frets, I check the clearance of each string at the first fret. A single thickness of regular printer paper should slide through without much resistance, but not a doubled-up piece. Almost every guitar I check has at least one high slot. I make any necessary adjustments.

3) I then set the neck relief to about .010"

4 I then measure the clearance under every string at the 12th fret using a machinist's caliper. From low to high, I shoot for an even drop of .008" from string to string. I target clearances of .110", .102", .094", .086", .078" and .070". If a string is too high, I will remove twice the offending amount from that location on the top of the saddle . . . making sure to restore any bevels for compensation. Most guitars come with a saddle that has the same radius as the fretboard . . . but the strings fan out as they go from nut to saddle. This generally means that the middle strings will be too high compared to the outer strings, making the action feel stiff. The above clearances are for light gauge strings. Mediums can go a bit lower . . . either by lowering the saddle or removing some neck relief.

Is this a little OCD? Well . . . . I'm an engineer. It comes with the territory . . . but every guitar I've done this on plays super-easy and buzz free all the way up the neck.

I like my guitars to set up for optimum performance.
Over the years, I have learned how to do most of it myself.
I like the action to be low but without any hint of fret buzz.

My choice for neck relief is almost flat but with just a small amount of bow.
I am a huge fan of fully compensated bone saddles.
I have them is all 5 of my guitars.

String choice is another thing.
I have tried many different brands and gone between light and medium gauge sets.
My personal choice for several years has been medium gauge phosphor bronze sets.
Recently I have been trying the Martin Retro strings with very good results.

Over the years I've had dozens of guitars, new and used, and I think there may have been maybe two or three that didn't need anything other than a string change and a good cleaning/detail. Most of them needed something (or some things) to make them right for my style of playing.
Here's how you know:
If you get the guitar and it sounds great, tunes up easily and stays in tune while playing, no buzzes or rattles anywhere, and it feels so good playing it that you don't want to put it down and it puts a huge smile on your face and you find yourself doing things you've never done before because you're having so much fun playing this amazing guitar... it needs nothing, and you lucked out and got a great guitar! I've had maybe two like that EVER.

If it doesn't do that, get a good luthier/tech and make it happen, or if it can't be made to play that way, return it or sell it! You only become a better guitarist if you actually PLAY the guitar...a LOT!

And you need to shop for a good luthier/ tech like you would shop for a doctor. Seriously. Get referrals, check Yelp, see if they have a website, ask around. And never just go for the cheapest guy! There are some guys doing this who shouldn't be allowed near guitars! And there are some who are true luthiers, and stand behind their work and can take a guitar you thought was alright and make it play like OMG!!! And you might go through a few guys til you find the right one, but it is so worth it when you do!
Don't be shy, be prepared to play for your luthier/tech. He needs to see what you're doing and why, and to make the adjustments for you!

At some point, you might get into needing different setups for different guitars... different tunings, slide, one for hard strumming, one for delicate finger-picking... whatever. That's why you see some players with a few different guitars during a set. Sometimes they're not just showing off, there's usually a reason that they are lugging so many guitars around! And you might end up buying one that was simply set up for a particular preference and it makes it hard for you to play. Your guy should be able to fix that!

Ultimately, you want your guitar/s to be the absolute best they can be. So that you can play effortlessly for hours on end as you are discovering new things about your playing.

When I finally decided to get fret files and nut files, I had two guitars in dire need of fret leveling. After doing those I just started grabbing my guitars and taking a close look at them. Every one benefited from a fret level. It is not that they were bad, just that they played better after a fret leveling. Just like getting new tires, you wonder how you could have gone so long.

So everything gets the full setup treatment after a few weeks to settle in.

Great insight, thanks! Another question I have -- I see a lot of you are doing quite a lot of stuff on your guitar. Where is the point where you think: "Oh oh, I need a Luthier" and when are you thinking, "I've got this?"

TIA!