The Great GSR mystery?

mavuser

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there were:

(11) GSR Starfire I Basses
(9) GSR Starfire II Basses
(total of 20 GSR Starfire basses)

(25) GSR M-85-II Basses
 

F312

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Does anyone know if hide glue was used in the production of the GSR or Reno guitars?

Ralph
 

chazmo

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I don't think hide glue was used for any GSRs, F312, Ralph, but maybe someone will correct me on that. Hide glue was used on the Orpheum series. But, again, I'm not aware of it being used on anything but Orpheums.
 

Rayk

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So does everyone feel
Confident that at least 20 of each GSR Acoustic were made more or less ?
 

adorshki

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So does everyone feel
Confident that at least 20 of each GSR Acoustic were made more or less ?
Yes because it was the initial economy of scale point for any build run.
When the feasibility of having a special "LTG edition" guitar get made was being discussed here, NH always said they'd build anything we spec'd as long as there were at least 20 ordered.
Well we got 20 different spec combinations instead so it never happened.
:glee:
(But still, true story!)
I'd say the initial "target" was 20 for any GSR but they started with some extras planned to allow for production fallout, and that's why we see some "overs" and even some "unders".
And for some reason I've got the number "40" in my head for the F40 Cocobolos, (in recognition of the model number) but I might be hallucinating that one.
 

Rayk

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Does the Serial number tell what number in the build run the guitars were ?
 

SFIV1967

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Does anyone know if hide glue was used in the production of the GSR or Reno guitars?
Titebond woodglue was used as far as I remember. Not hide glue. The Reno models were built for lowest possible price (like a lot in satin finish), so hideglue is unlikely.

Confident that at least 20 of each GSR Acoustic were made more or less ?
Well, if you read the posted links there was at least one model were only two were produced...So no, not confident.

but they started with some extras planned to allow for production fallout
I think that is pure speculation on your side...

And for some reason I've got the number "40" in my head for the F40 Cocobolos, (in recognition of the model number) but I might be hallucinating that one.
I think you mix this up with the sixty 60ties anniversary model. There were never numbers published for the F-40 Cocobolo, neither in the press release nor the webpage or from any dealers. Just as example, some models gave a clear planned number already in the press release: http://guildguitars.com/guild-unveils-limited-run-gsr-d-50-dreadnought/

Does the Serial number tell what number in the build run the guitars were ?
Al: How would you be able to read out of a NH serial number if the guitar was number 12 of 20 ???? The answer should be "no". Unless the label had a handwritten note on it saying number 12 of 20. Which was not the case for all models! I don't think the acoustic models had this, only the electric models.

Ralf
 
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Rich Cohen

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Well, if you read the posted links there was at least one model were only two were produced...So no, not confident.

I think that is pure speculation on your side...

I think you mix this up with the sixty 60ties anniversary model. There were never numbers published for the F-40 Cocobolo, neither in the press release nor the webpage or from any dealers.

Al: How would you be able to read out of a NH serial number if the guitar was number 12 of 20 ???? The answer should be "no". Unless the label had a handwritten note on it saying number 12 of 20. Which was not the case for all models! I don't think the acoustic models had this, only the electric models.

Ralf

That's correct. I owned a NH X-180 GSR that was #5 of 5, as it said on the label.
 

Rayk

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Ok do we have this from the old thread

but there are models were as few as 2 were made by various reasons.
Usually the deal was 10 are sold in the US and Canada and 10 between Europe and Asia.

Model ----------------------Production #
GSR F-20 Cocobolo------------20
GSR F-30CE Cocobolo-------20
GSR F-30 Maple----------------20
GSR F-30 Rosewood----------20
GSR F-40 Cocobolo -----------
GSR F-40 Macassar-----------only 2
GSR F-47KC Koa---------------
GSR F-50 Koa -------------------
GSR D-40 Noir Mahogany----
GSR D-50 Cocobolo -----------20

Ok so forgive my short term memory ,

How is it known that 5 models had 20 built for sure and 1 had 2 builds and 4 other models are unknown ?

Is this eststablished from online listings ?
 

Rich Cohen

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Ok do we have this from the old thread

but there are models were as few as 2 were made by various reasons.
Usually the deal was 10 are sold in the US and Canada and 10 between Europe and Asia.

Model ----------------------Production #
GSR F-20 Cocobolo------------20
GSR F-30CE Cocobolo-------20
GSR F-30 Maple----------------20
GSR F-30 Rosewood----------20
GSR F-40 Cocobolo -----------
GSR F-40 Macassar-----------only 2
GSR F-47KC Koa---------------
GSR F-50 Koa -------------------
GSR D-40 Noir Mahogany----
GSR D-50 Cocobolo -----------20

Ok so forgive my short term memory ,

How is it known that 5 models had 20 built for sure and 1 had 2 builds and 4 other models are unknown ?

Is this eststablished from online listings ?

Logic would suggest that #20 was common run for GSR models, and it sort of makes sense, no? If you're goin' to invest in tone wood, why make only a run of 2, unless there are extenuating circumstances.
 

txbumper57

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Does the Serial number tell what number in the build run the guitars were ?

Unlike my D55 50th Anniversary from Corona that actually has what number of 50 made it is on the label, None of the Acoustic GSR Guitars had a label like this that I have seen. The GSR Acoustics just had GSR and what model they were listed on a regular label with a regular N.H. serial number. No way to tell which one was which unless you had the Ledger from New Hartford to look it up. The GSR Electric models did have a label that listed what number of the run they were and that label resembled and Old Westerly Label as a tribute to Guild's previous legacy.

TX
 

SFIV1967

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How is it known that 5 models had 20 built for sure...
The "for sure" is not correct. Those numbers were given in the press releases when the guitars were introduced, not when the run was finished building! Big difference. I don't know if somebody counted the runs, I counted two of the guitars but wasn't able to track down all 20 guitars. For instance on the GSR D-50 Cocobolo I know of 15 which appeared on the internet over time. For the GSR F-30R I found 13. But this is only what I was able to find, I am sure the others were produced and sold as well, just not shown on the internet.
The info of the model where only two were made is from inside Guild, there were reasons that they stopped that built after only two. The unknown number means the press release did not give numbers.
I would recommand to not think so much about all those details...Are you planning to write a book about GSR models ???

None of the Acoustic GSR Guitars had a label like this that I have seen.
And the 60th Anniversary model, which actually had the run number listed, was a Custom Shop model, not a GSR model.

p6_uo51quytc_so.jpg


And this is how the electric guitar labels looked, as TX mentioned above. Here a GSR T-400:
ku7gut9ihhuqn4e7cqni.jpg

Talking about the New Hartford ledger book...

2VOKBZU.jpg


Ralf
 
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Rayk

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Logic would suggest that #20 was common run for GSR models, and it sort of makes sense, no? If you're goin' to invest in tone wood, why make only a run of 2, unless there are extenuating circumstances.

Hmm should I name you secretly Spock ? or Tuvok ?
Haha

I guess I'm just seeing ( yeah it's just a visual thang ) that some on the list , listed 20 and the rest are blank which made me ask if for some reason those numbers aren't on the known "twenty list "

The Madagascar model only had 2 so not 20 . I'll re read the thread but not sure where the confirmation of 2 came from on that model do off go ;)
 

SFIV1967

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The Madagascar model only had 2 so not 20 . I'll re read the thread but not sure where the confirmation of 2 came from on that model do off go ;)
See post number 33 above...And it was not "Madagascar" but "Macassar" (Ebony)!
Ralf
 

Rayk

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Ok I see boy you folks respond fast haha .

Ralf I don't have the smarts to write a book that I know of but I am good at asking questions which of course has the unfortunate side effect of ticking some folks off haha but it's not my intent .

So how did you come across this models to come up with a number ? I mean did you log each serial number ? How did you know it was not a resale of one you already seen ?

I'm only asking this as I find it interesting and if anyone should write a book you sir should lead the pack ;)
 

Rayk

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Oooo now I got the serial numbers down or at least some of them lol
 

chazmo

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Guys, 20 was a guideline (not a rule) for a GSR. NH management told us that they probably wouldn't do a GSR without making 20 of them, but we know of longer and (much) shorter runs. And, no, the serial numbers don't tell you anything about the number of any model that was built.

As far as the spectacular 60th anniversary F-30 model, it may not have been called a "Custom Shop" guitar, but that was right around the time the Custom Shop moniker got started. What I can relay to you was that "GSR" started early on at NH as some small, custom dealer orders from when Guild had a dealer summit. In fact, I do believe the "GSR" referred to "Guild Summit Retreat" originally but morphed into "Guild Special Run." I'm not 100% sure of that though. Anyway the idea of GSR was small modifications from the production guitars, built on the same line. I think they introduced the "Custom Shop" when Ren Fergusen joined to give him some more freedom to do some branching out. The Orpheums are a good example of that.

Hope that helps. That's my recollection anyway.
 

Rayk

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Interesting , were the GSR models started before Ren joined Guild ?
What Models were built in the Custom shop apposed to the regular build line ?
 
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SFIV1967

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Interesting, where the GSR models started before Ren joined Guild ?
Yes. GSR models exist since 2009 and had nothing to do with Ren at that time. Ren only joined FMIC in January 2012: http://spotlight.fender.com/newsroom/news/180/

What Models were built in the Custom shop apposed to the regular build line ?
As far as the spectacular 60th anniversary F-30 model, it may not have been called a "Custom Shop" guitar, but that was right around the time the Custom Shop moniker got started....In fact, I do believe the "GSR" referred to "Guild Summit Retreat" originally but morphed into "Guild Special Run."
O.k., I answer both. @Chazmo: Look at the first picture in post #33 above...and you will have your answer. Anyway, please read the link with the original press release and you have all answers: http://spotlight.fender.com/newsroom/news/298/

As Guild was FMIC owned the GSR designation stands for "Guild Special Run" in the same way as FSR is a "Fender Special Run". The GSR series itself was first revealed to Guild dealers at Guild's dealer-only factory tour in mid-2009 called the "Guild Summit Retreat", so no, GSR did not stand for Guild Summit Retreat...

Ralf
 
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