Bonneville88
Senior Member
Sometimes nautical glue might just make a difference!
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Westerly Guild F50...Need Help Quickly Please
- Thread starter sixx
- Start date
Good one, Chris! But you forgot the belaying pins that hold the lanyards in the cleat. :biggrin-new:
For certain! Good catch, Rick, Thanks. Now updated!
adorshki
Reverential Member
Upper right hand of forum home page, hit "Settings" button.
Scroll down on left hand to "My Settings" and "Edit Signature"
:friendly_wink:
friggin' - sailor's speak for "frigate rigging" (or "rigging the frigate"). Over at AGF they would refer to this process as "stringing up your Guild". But we, with our special Nautical Glue constructed guitars, we have our own terminology. Argh!
A hearty welcome aboard LTG, sixx!
txbumper57
Enlightened Member
YAY, with all this talk of Nautical Glue Now I can tell my favorite Pirate Joke again!
Man walks up to a Pirate and says, "Excuse me Mr. Pirate but did you know you have a steering wheel attached to the zipper of your pants?". The Pirate replied, "ARRGHH! It's Driving Me Nuts!".
TX
Man walks up to a Pirate and says, "Excuse me Mr. Pirate but did you know you have a steering wheel attached to the zipper of your pants?". The Pirate replied, "ARRGHH! It's Driving Me Nuts!".
TX
"Man walks up to a Pirate and says, "Excuse me Mr. Pirate but did you know you have a steering wheel attached to the zipper of your pants?". The Pirate replied, "ARRGHH! It's Driving Me Nuts!"
Thanks for the morning laugh!
Thanks for the morning laugh!
fronobulax
Bassist, GAD and the Hot Mess Mods
- Joined
- May 3, 2007
- Messages
- 24,790
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- Central Virginia, USA
- Guild Total
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Seaworthiness: I have taken the necks off about 15 Guilds, to date. Sadly, I have ne'er encountered Nautical Glue in that neck joint. They all had used hide glue, and none of them were more difficult to remove than any other glued-in dovetail I have ever encountered.
That is hilarious. Good work, Chris.
Thanks, Jaime. All in good fun, of course.
Should anyone reading this thread be concerned or confused, it is my belief that the Guild F-50N Nautical model *never* existed, nor was Nautical glue ever used in the construction of any Guild, nor were Nautical terms ever used to describe the guitar components (at least not to my knowledge - perhaps Hans can confirm
). The hearsay that someone at the factory could "swear like a sailor" is not proof to the contrary.
Should anyone reading this thread be concerned or confused, it is my belief that the Guild F-50N Nautical model *never* existed, nor was Nautical glue ever used in the construction of any Guild, nor were Nautical terms ever used to describe the guitar components (at least not to my knowledge - perhaps Hans can confirm
Neal
Senior Member
You know, every day, I log onto this site just to see what interesting topic might come up.
This one is a prime example.
This one is a prime example.
adorshki
Reverential Member
I actually first stumbled across that term in some Victorian literature, with a very different interpretation.
To be sure, as my definition is entirely fictitious! ;~}
adorshki
Reverential Member
A quick search for "Marine glue" yesterday revealed there is a type of waterproof Titebond, but like all aliphatic resin glues, the creep strength is not as good as good old hideglue.
But it's easier on set-up and easier to break loose for reset, which was said to be why it was adapted in New Hartford (not the waterproof kind, AFAIK).
http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?64316-Titebond-3-waterproof-glue
Some may remember the travails of one of our members whose early New Hartford 12-string on which the bridge was re-worked twice before Fender finally authorized a warranty neck reset on a 2-year old guitar.nor were Nautical terms ever used to describe the guitar components (at least not to my knowledge - perhaps Hans can confirm). The hearsay that someone at the factory could "swear like a sailor" is not proof to the contrary.
He was said to be swearing like a Marine over the hoops he was made to jump through, for a while there.
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PTC Bernie
Member
Yeah, I was trying to remember when Titebond introduced that Titebond II which was suppoed to be water resistant and better for outdoor use. I was wondering if that was what they were referring to.
OTOH, the comments about Guild "Using tons of glue..." didn't make sense either. In a properly shaved DoveTail joint, the tighness of the fit is what makes the joint secure, not the amount of glue. Any excess glue would be pushed out of the joint anyway.
fronobulax
Bassist, GAD and the Hot Mess Mods
- Joined
- May 3, 2007
- Messages
- 24,790
- Reaction score
- 8,921
- Location
- Central Virginia, USA
- Guild Total
- 5
I remember things that did not happen and I explain things I don't understand. With that in mind, the comments I recall about "lots of glue" referred to the situation where the joint was not tight and some combination of excess glue and wood shims were used to make the joint tight enough.
LOL - Man, I relate!
I think you remember correctly.
The dovetail is a (compound) V-shaped tenon. A rectangular tenon is inserted into a mortise and, unless it is "pinned", relies entirely on glue to hold it in place. A dovetailed tenon is "slid" into place. It's "shoulders", being wider at the back than at the front, prohibit it from being directly inserted into the face of the mortise and, subsequently, resist it's removal. Typically, the mortise is cut a wee bit deeper than the tenon is long, and glue is merely applied to the shoulders of the tenon to prevent it from shifting (let alone "sliding" up and back out of it's position).
Shims are used when the shoulders of the tenon are narrower enough than the width of the mortise to prevent making a secure joint.
I believe that the infamous reputation for "Guild necks being so hard to remove" could stem, in part, from A.) too much glue being used in the dovetail joint, where glue is *not* just applied to the shoulders, but is also filling the (small) cavity between the end of the tenon and the base of the mortise and/or B.) Cutting the mortise deeper than needed and See A.
I have never encountered such a condition, as all the Guild necks I have removed came out with nary an effort. I either have been downright lucky, or someone else's misfortunate tale became taller with the telling.
Small space between base of mortise and end of tenon:
Applying shims to the shoulders of the tenon to tighten the joint (gap is more evident):
Even though glue does not bond well, end grain to end grain, flooding the compartment with glue could make for a more difficult time of neck removal. Unless it is epoxy, the glue softens with sufficient heat (steam) and good technique will remove the neck.
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