F-40's D-tar question

kdavid

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curious about the D-tar unit that came on my F-40
i do like the ability to control the volume & tone from the soundhole, & the ease of changing the batteries right from the strap button...
also that i dont seem to need the Fishman Platinum Stage to preamp into my Loudbox mini.
Wondered about the different batteries-not the 9 volt i normally see
as well as all the added weight
what wouldve been the benefits then as i see the units arnt used by Oxnard if indeed they're still being manufractered these days
thank you.
 

richardp69

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I assume you're talking about the Dtar Lock and Load system. I don't know the positives or negatives of the system itself but I really like how it works. I don't care for the looks of the large metal piece you unscrew to get to the batteries and I'd prefer not to have the extra weight but I do love the ease of use/ease of battery replacement and I think the pickup itself is superb.
 

txbumper57

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Hey KDavid, That is the Early DTAR Lock N' Load system that you have. It is a UST or under saddle transducer pickup that has a built in 18 volt preamp instead of the normal 9 volt you see on other pickup systems. The reason for this is with the 9 volt systems you will get a Quack sound from the pickup when you really try to push the guitar and play harder. With the 18 volt DTAR system there is no upper ceiling on the pickup due to the extra voltage. This means that when you play hard it still reproduces the sound of the guitar instead of having that quack. It also allows you to play soft and delicate without losing all the subtle nuances of tone in your guitar. There is a newer version of your pickup called the DTAR Wavelength 18 volt system which actually hold the batteries inside the guitar. These came factory on some of the Guild Standard series acoustics from New Hartford. The top of the line is the Newer DTAR Wavelength Multisource 18 Volt pickup which came as a Factory option in most of the New Hartford Traditional Series Guitars. This system adds a Condenser mic that is mounted on the sound hole control circuit board into the mix. You can blend the mic in and out as you see fit.

Both of the newer pickups are still available through Musician's Friend and other online sites such as Amazon. The regular DTAR Wavelength 18 volt with internal battery mount runs around $100-$110. It has the ability to upgrade it at a later date and add the condenser mic if you want just by plugging in the mic unit on the internal preamp.

The DTAR Wavelength Multisource 18 volt with the Mic runs between $150-$190 New and comes with everything that was installed on the later built New Hartford Traditional series Guilds.

Personally I think the reasoning behind not continuing to use the DTAR systems in Oxnard comes down purely to Cost and New Ownership. They probably cut a good deal with LR Baggs or have some affiliation with them. Honestly the Baggs pickup they are using in the newer Guilds isn't even in the same Ballpark in my opinion for performance and tone reproduction. Like I said though, That is just my opinion and others may vary. Hope this info Helps and have a Great Day!


TX
 

Bill Ashton

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If I remember correctly, DTAR is no more, though Seymour Duncan (one of the partners) was supposed to start them up again.

I think that there was a caviat to only use zinc carbon or alkaline batteries in the loc'n'load unit, ni-cad rechargeables are too big and can
get stuck in the tube...maybe a search on that here will help you out...
 

kdavid

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Thanks! lock & load--thats what i was trying to remember. was curious about the 18 volt & thought there was something to it because when playing at church i couldlent seem to get it to quack at all. the quack from mckaila (the DV6) would be bothersome no matter the volume.
o'course that was a passive system without batteries
the multisource made me think of the Fishman rare earth blend ('cept for the soundhole pickup) i had installed on a GAD212 i had for all too brief a time (& would gladly try to find a way to get it back) i do like the responsive-ness that i dont seem to need to be twisting dials all the time --but i do like having a volume & tone control just inside the soundhole if necessary.
i will admit that im very happy with this system--only a couple small flaws: as Richard mentions, that big metal disc that must be unscrewed to change batteries & the weight thats added to the bottom of my favorite guitar (which really isnt that big a deal there) ive no plans to swap it out yet, as i hoping to install a JJB in the M-20. its becoming a bit of a chore installing the rare earth humbucker when needed then uninstalling it when done.
maybe in the future i can see a multisource as i did like the added 'air' that a condenser mic added to the F-man blend on my little 12 string way back then :)
Thank you for helping this old guy understand this particular pickup.
personally, i think its a fine system & it seems to be very compatable with my loudbox, with the old crate...& whatever p.a. that coffeeshop was using.
thank you my friends
 

adorshki

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I think that there was a caviat to only use zinc carbon or alkaline batteries in the loc'n'load unit, ni-cad rechargeables are too big and can
get stuck in the tube...maybe a search on that here will help you out...

Dat do ring a big bell. Remember one member questioning why batteries were stuck in holder, the later explanation about battery type being important, not so clearly.
 

kdavid

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Bill & Al, im glad you made the point to bring up the point about the batteries
seems that'll be important info
i know im glad to know it now :eagerness:
 

GuildFS4612CE

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When batteries get hot, the casing expands...most of the time, if they're stuck, just wait until everything has cooled down and contracted sufficiently to remove them.

As an Aside:

Rechargeable batteries, do not have the full equivalent voltage of the non rechargeable...for example, a AA rechargeable likely only has, at most, 1.2 Volts at full charge, where a new non rechargeable AA would be a full 1.5 Volts...similar situation exists with 9 volt rechargeable...with sound reproduction, the performance will suffer, vocals in particular, when underpowered. An example would be a portable battery powered amplifier that runs on 8 AA's = 12 volts...try 8 rechargeable AA's, and the system would likely only be receiving around 9 Volts...unless the amp is designed with an extra circuit allowing it to run on 9 volts...the output will suffer greatly...same as when your batteries start running low and you know it's time to change to fresh ones.
 

txbumper57

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There has always been issues with the Non uniform sizes of the same style of battery in any type of battery holder like the DTAR Lock N' Load has. The Taylor expression pickup that was used in the mid to late 2000's took a few AA batteries and also had a hang up with the battery holder. If I remember correctly you had to wrap a post-it note around the batteries themselves before inserting them to allow a proper connection with the contacts and to avoid the battery casings touching the sides of the holder which would result in the pickup system not working. I thought it was a little strange back then when my new 914ce Koa actually had the post it note installed from the factory around the batteries.

Because of these issues and the issues raised in GuildFS4612CE's previous post, if I have a guitar with the same style battery holder as the DTAR Lock N' Load I always make it a point to use new Non Rechargeable batteries preferably from a Mainstream company like Energizer. They normally have a much higher rate of uniformity in size and shape as well as output life when compared to the smaller off brand name companies do.

I am not sure about the DTAR Lock N' Load but I know when My DTAR Wavelength Multisource pickups start running low on voltage or have batteries with lower voltage specs installed they can begin to make a howling noise.

TX
 
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