Most HIDEOUS GUITAR STORE EXPERIENCE EVER......

Stunning, really. If there is a type of store that should be welcoming it's a music store, right? Let's talk abut guitars or other instruments, let's get comfortable, let's find the one that "speaks" to me - SO I CAN BUY IT!

I'm so lucky to have a friendly local music shop near me - just there the other day and even though I only bought a set of strings, had a nice conversation about guitars and strings with a guy who I feel I know pretty well just from visiting the store. A simple, pleasant experience...

walrus

Cintiollis is a local shop that moved to within five blocks of me. There is one kid I would deal with, but the rest of them are egotistical clowns.

Sorry for the hideous experience, Tom. I don't imagine those guys will be around long. Maybe somebody who likes guitars (and guitar players) will buy them out... at a greatly reduced price.

My art studio is right next door to one of the oldest little guitar stores on the west side of Los Angeles - "Guitar Connection"

His Yelp reviews are worse than J&E's. I hear him screaming at his customers on a nearly daily basis. He will pick a fight over any little issue - and when I say fight, I mean he will literally assault people on the way out the door. How he isn't in prison yet is a big mystery. And everybody in the neighborhood has the exact same question - HOW DOES THIS GUY STAY IN BUSINESS? Yet there he is, still putting his sign out every day at 12 noon and getting mean drunk no later than 6, rinse and repeat.

my son an I occupied the high end acoustic room at GC for about an hour, jamming away...

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But...don't tell me your THAT guy ! I wanted to come in a try a few guitars in there, but you two where auditioning and didn't feel like interrupting to try one.

OK, maybe you were playing moderately and not hogging the sound space, and I could have felt like walking in and noodling on a few to get a feel for them , right ?

Los Angeles said:

My art studio is right next door to one of the oldest little guitar stores on the west side of Los Angeles - "Guitar Connection"

His Yelp reviews are worse than J&E's. I hear him screaming at his customers on a nearly daily basis. He will pick a fight over any little issue - and when I say fight, I mean he will literally assault people on the way out the door. How he isn't in prison yet is a big mystery. And everybody in the neighborhood has the exact same question - HOW DOES THIS GUY STAY IN BUSINESS? Yet there he is, still putting his sign out every day at 12 noon and getting mean drunk no later than 6, rinse and repeat.

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Dude, seriously? Don't you wonder? I've never seen any cars outside although I've not stalked the building. But on the way out, I'm like, "Oh look, they don't look busy, let's stop on the way home!" So when we finally did, there was NO ONE. NO ONE. And they actually seemed irritated to see us there. They've been open about a year, I think. How long can they do that? Maybe they get a KILLER weekend crowd? I'll not be stopping by to see, but it does make you wonder, you know? :jaded:

Cougar said:

Sorry for the hideous experience, Tom. I don't imagine those guys will be around long. Maybe somebody who likes guitars (and guitar players) will buy them out... at a greatly reduced price.

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Wouldn't that be nice? But the trouble is..... the hardest thing in the WORLD is to get a customer back after you've pissed them off. It usually takes very little to KEEP a customer, but to get them back after you've lost them? That's almost impossible. But if I see a huge sign that says, "UNDER NEW MANAGEMENT" up.... I'd go in. If I saw either of those guys, I'd walk right out again!!

Los Angeles said:

My art studio is right next door to one of the oldest little guitar stores on the west side of Los Angeles - "Guitar Connection"

His Yelp reviews are worse than J&E's. I hear him screaming at his customers on a nearly daily basis. He will pick a fight over any little issue - and when I say fight, I mean he will literally assault people on the way out the door. How he isn't in prison yet is a big mystery. And everybody in the neighborhood has the exact same question - HOW DOES THIS GUY STAY IN BUSINESS? Yet there he is, still putting his sign out every day at 12 noon and getting mean drunk no later than 6, rinse and repeat.

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Hello LA,

You might remember that I told you I visited that same guy during one of my earlier visits to the U.S. I actually remember his last name, because it sounded like his family was originally from the Netherlands. It was more than 30 years ago and I don't remember him being drunk, but it was a weird experience, because it was not really clear to me if I was visiting a music store or a shed in the back of somebody's house. At the time I was looking for 'vintage' parts for guitar repairs, something I'm still doing to this day. It was the middle of the 'customizing craze' of the '80s and everybody was changing their original hardware and pickups and installing stuff from the various aftermarket businesses that were trying to convince people they could improve their guitars by using their product; in the end very few of these products actually did!

While I was going through his drawers and various parts boxes I found some neat stuff that I definitely could use. I clearly remember a complete set of gold plated Kluson Deluxe, single line, tuners, complete with bushings and to this day I wonder what guitar these tuners could have been removed from and what he would have replaced these tuners with! I do know that eventually I sold them to a guy who had an original Mary Kaye Strat with worn out tuners and he was really happy to give me a lot of money for the set.

Anyway, the owner of the place looked like he didn't have a clue why I was looking for that stuff, but he was happy to sell it to me. Apparently he's still in business in spite of his manners. I'm really happy he is, because most of the 'small time' music stores are no longer there, most of them pushed out by the big chain stores. I have lots of fond memories of going to all these 'mom and pop' stores, with hard working people who never became rich, but who were doing it because their hearts were in it! I like to think that your 'angry' neighbour at some point started the business for the right reasons, but I guess somewhere along the way things got bad!

Sincerely,

Hans Moust
www.guitarsgalore.nl

If they do any business at all, it's probably online. Can't imagine them treating new customers like that!
But I do know some retail sales people get really sour attitudes after awhile, be it in the music biz, the car biz, whatever. However, the successful ones are the ones with positive, friendly attitudes. They know that they may not get you today...but they keep the opportunity alive!

We have a rather famous (infamous?LOL) vintage guitar store here in the valley, and if you are a BIG name, the owner treats you like royalty! If you're just a working stiff, you're better off dealing with one of the sales guys...they are actually great guys! I think the owner kinda likes the old-school "good cop/bad cop" retail model. It's actually kind of funny. We've bought 3 or 4 guitars from his store over the last few years, but if we had to deal with the owner, it probably never would have happened. And I think he knows it, and it's OK with him! just kinda odd in this day and age, that's all.

The Retro Rocker said:

I think the owner kinda likes the old-school "good cop/bad cop" retail model. It's actually kind of funny. We've bought 3 or 4 guitars from his store over the last few years, but if we had to deal with the owner, it probably never would have happened. And I think he knows it, and it's OK with him! just kinda odd in this day and age, that's all.

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You just reminded me of a guy who astounded me when I was selling cars.
He'd tell people in the rudest possible way they couldn't possibly buy the car they wanted and they'd wind up doing anything they could just to prove him wrong!
Somehow I could never make that work for me.
:biggrin-new:
And yeah you wanna talk getting soured on people, try selling cars.
It occurs to me that guitars aren't that much different, probably gotta be at least 9 tirekickers for every real buyer.
I used to get asked "Did you get burned out on lying to people?"
No, I got burned out on people lying to me.

hansmoust said:

Hello LA,

You might remember that I told you I visited that same guy during one of my earlier visits to the U.S. I actually remember his last name, because it sounded like his family was originally from the Netherlands. It was more than 30 years ago and I don't remember him being drunk, but it was a weird experience, because it was not really clear to me if I was visiting a music store or a shed in the back of somebody's house. At the time I was looking for 'vintage' parts for guitar repairs, something I'm still doing to this day. It was the middle of the 'customizing craze' of the '80s and everybody was changing their original hardware and pickups and installing stuff from the various aftermarket businesses that were trying to convince people they could improve their guitars by using their product; in the end very few of these products actually did!

While I was going through his drawers and various parts boxes I found some neat stuff that I definitely could use. I clearly remember a complete set of gold plated Kluson Deluxe, single line, tuners, complete with bushings and to this day I wonder what guitar these tuners could have been removed from and what he would have replaced these tuners with! I do know that eventually I sold them to a guy who had an original Mary Kaye Strat with worn out tuners and he was really happy to give me a lot of money for the set.

Anyway, the owner of the place looked like he didn't have a clue why I was looking for that stuff, but he was happy to sell it to me. Apparently he's still in business in spite of his manners. I'm really happy he is, because most of the 'small time' music stores are no longer there, most of them pushed out by the big chain stores. I have lots of fond memories of going to all these 'mom and pop' stores, with hard working people who never became rich, but who were doing it because their hearts were in it! I like to think that your 'angry' neighbour at some point started the business for the right reasons, but I guess somewhere along the way things got bad!

Sincerely,

Hans Moust
www.guitarsgalore.nl

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He likely 'stays in business' because he owns the premises...the storefront, and the rental units in back...probably doesn't have to sell much...and he's apparently had that severe drinking problem for a very long time.

GuildFS4612CE said:

He likely 'stays in business' because he owns the premises...the storefront, and the rental units in back...probably doesn't have to sell much...and he's apparently had that severe drinking problem for a very long time.

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Yeah I was thinking about similar scenarios for some of the others mentioned.
They don't have to be a "front for something else", and suspect that could only last so long before authorities get wise anyway.
Maybe they're whittling away an inheritance or some other windfall, and don't actually need to sell much to keep the doors open.
In fact, trying to be sympathetic, maybe they're actually better off doing something, anything, even if not too good at it, than self-medicating or worse in the potentially dangerous anonymity of their homes.

JohnW63 said:

But...don't tell me your THAT guy ! I wanted to come in a try a few guitars in there, but you two where auditioning and didn't feel like interrupting to try one.

OK, maybe you were playing moderately and not hogging the sound space, and I could have felt like walking in and noodling on a few to get a feel for them , right ?

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John, that was you, standing outside the glass door?
Dude... we would've invited you to join in... or might well have stopped playing and left if it was obvious you wanted to sit and
noodle quietly. Also would have been really cool if the sales guy had grabbed a guitar and sat in!

Something tells me the owners of that store seem to judge the book by its cover. Meaning they think they know who will buy and who is just there to look and the lookers get no respect or even disrespect. Its sad as it looks like a nice shop but no matter, they are only hurting themselves with the attitudes and I am sure they won't be open much longer. At least in NJ I have the best guitar shop to visit and buy or even just look.

Sitedrifter said:

Something tells me the owners of that store seem to judge the book by its cover. Meaning they think they know who will buy and who is just there to look and the lookers get no respect or even disrespect.

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That's a pretty common syndrome in retail.
It's called "Eyeballing" and in fact you're supposed to put all the visual stereotypes aside and go say "Hi" anyway.
The guy in the fancy suit is likely gonna be maxed out on his credit and "upside down" on his year-old Cadillac while the working class family with 1 or 2 kids and a pregnant wife who hop out of their compact 2-door and start to look at the row of used Caravans were just about a slam-dunk every time.
When selling cars it's almost inevitable that after a couple of years you start recognizing subtle body English that tells you that somebody's not really there to buy a car or even "get a price".
I can see that easily translating to similar retail models like guitars and other "big ticket" (over $1000.00) items.
Best cue was always when somebody looked through the driver's window to see what kind of mileage or accessories it had,
That was always best time to approach.
One day one of my "Teammates" came back to me after "upping" (meet and greet to start the sales process) a couple I'd told him he could "have" and expressed his surprise that I had almost a 100% accuracy rate at "eyeballing".
The other side of the coin is when you spot somebody telegraphing all the signals but you don't want to rush them (What everybody hates about car shopping and makes 'em defensive right off the bat), but there's always somebody else who will.
In any case, there's no reason to be rude except for that guy who somehow made it work for him, LOL!:
"HI WELCOME TO STEAL A DEAL! WHAT CAN I DO YA FER TODAY?"
"We're just looking, thanks"
"OH, CREDIT SUCKS, HUH? WELL YOU JUST LET US WORRY ABOUT THAT!"
"Oh if you could just give us your card we'll ask for you when we come back next week" (Number one buyer's lie of all time)
"HEY YOU DON'T HAVE TO LIE TO ME. I'LL STILL GET YOU THE BEST DEAL YOU CAN POSSIBLY GET TODAY BUT THIS THING'S PROBABLY WAY OUTSIDE YOUR BUDGET!"
"Well how much is it really?"
"WELL YOU KNOW, IF YOU HAVE TO ASK...HAHHAHAHHA!!"
"We're asking"
"TELL YA WHAT TAKE A LOOK AT THIS NICE LEASE RETURN, 2 YEAR OLD DODGE DYNASTY WITH ONLY 40,0000 MILES ON IT. YOU COULD GET IT TODAY FOR ONLY 30 CENTS A MILE!"
"Why do you have a used Dodge at a Plymouth dealer?"
"SEE!! I TOLD YOU THIS IS WHAT YOU NEED!!"
"We really have to go but we'll come back next week and if the Voyager's still here we'll ask for you"
Soooo.....in that scenario, who actually lied twice?
So burnout in retail sales does have some foundation in experience.

Well, I wonder how this guy (Jesse) or his partner (Eric) categorized me when I came in. I said hello, and introduced myself. I was polite. I mentioned a mutual friend that they both used to work with. I talked about a bad experience with GC and then spoke of a specific model guitar and told them I found on the Breedlove site that they were authorized dealers and that was valuable to me. I spoke with knowledge about Guild and their changes when he said "They didn't impress me.". I'm in my 60's and Don is early 70's. We dress casually, but nice.

What really made me stop and think, was when he said they had some Breedloves in stock. I said, "Yes, they look very nice but I'm interested in one of the ones made in Bend, OR, rather than the Chinese built ones. Then he launched into some rhetoric about, "You know the trouble is proportionately I make less money off a $6,000 guitar than I do on a $600 guitar. The profit margin is much less than it is on the less expensive ones."

I thought, "Why are you telling me this? Am I, a potential customer, supposed to be worried about your profit margin? And, if all that is even true, why do you have so many $6,000 guitars on your wall? Also, using "proportionately" means you make some serious money on a high end guitar....."

It just didn't make any sense and rubbed me the wrong way. Of course, the whole experience rubbed me the wrong way.

I'm serious about buying a guitar, this specific guitar. If they'd played it right, I probably would've slapped down my card and said, "Let's do it." In my experience so far, I guess everyone just wants to sell what they have on their wall. But I doubt they have many $2000 sales falling out of the sky in that place. Maybe I'm wrong.

What I've found so far, is that the key to this whole guitar I want to buy is, that it be a model "that they normally stock". GC used the same phrase. So I'll just find a dealer that has one and make sure they stock it, verify a return policy in the super rare chance that I won't like it, and buy online. Apparently, that's the only way to go.

So much for trying to support my local brick and mortar businesses. So far, it's a big, huge FAIL.

davismanLV said:

Well, I wonder how this guy (Jesse) or his partner (Eric) categorized me when I came in. I said hello, and introduced myself. I was polite. I mentioned a mutual friend that they both used to work with. I talked about a bad experience with GC and then spoke of a specific model guitar and told them I found on the Breedlove site that they were authorized dealers and that was valuable to me. I spoke with knowledge about Guild and their changes when he said "They didn't impress me.". I'm in my 60's and Don is early 70's. We dress casually, but nice.

What really made me stop and think, was when he said they had some Breedloves in stock. I said, "Yes, they look very nice but I'm interested in one of the ones made in Bend, OR, rather than the Chinese built ones. Then he launched into some rhetoric about, "You know the trouble is proportionately I make less money off a $6,000 guitar than I do on a $600 guitar. The profit margin is much less than it is on the less expensive ones."

I thought, "Why are you telling me this? Am I, a potential customer, supposed to be worried about your profit margin? And, if all that is even true, why do you have so many $6,000 guitars on your wall? Also, using "proportionately" means you make some serious money on a high end guitar....."

It just didn't make any sense and rubbed me the wrong way. Of course, the whole experience rubbed me the wrong way.

I'm serious about buying a guitar, this specific guitar. If they'd played it right, I probably would've slapped down my card and said, "Let's do it." In my experience so far, I guess everyone just wants to sell what they have on their wall. But I doubt they have many $2000 sales falling out of the sky in that place. Maybe I'm wrong.

What I've found so far, is that the key to this whole guitar I want to buy is, that it be a model "that they normally stock". GC used the same phrase. So I'll just find a dealer that has one and make sure they stock it, verify a return policy in the super rare chance that I won't like it, and buy online. Apparently, that's the only way to go.

So much for trying to support my local brick and mortar businesses. So far, it's a big, huge FAIL.

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Tom, don't make me quote Frozen at you! Didn't even see the damned movie and don't want that tune in my head!

Okay, I'm starting to understand your fustration, Tom. Maybe these guys know a little something about the instuments they sell, but they certainly aren't a couple of whizzes when it comes to the numbers, are they? Maybe you walked in right after they had talked to their accountant or banker.

AcornHouse said:

Tom, don't make me quote Frozen at you! Didn't even see the damned movie and don't want that tune in my head!

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You sure you don't want that tune in your head Acorn? Here it is just in case you were being sarcastic. LOL!:triumphant:

Let It Go
Idina Menzel





The snow glows white on the mountain tonight
Not a footprint to be seen.
A kingdom of isolation,
and it looks like I'm the Queen
The wind is howling like this swirling storm inside
Couldn't keep it in;
Heaven knows I've tried
Don't let them in,
don't let them see
Be the good girl you always have to be
Conceal, don't feel,
don't let them know
Well now they know
Let it go, let it go
Can't hold it back anymore
Let it go, let it go
Turn away and slam the door
I don't care
what they're going to say
Let the storm rage on.
The cold never bothered me anyway
It's funny how some distance
Makes everything seem small
And the fears that once controlled me
Can't get to me at all

It's time to see what I can do
To test the limits and break through
No right, no wrong, no rules for me,
I'm free!
Let it go, let it go
I am one with the wind and sky
Let it go, let it go
You'll never see me cry
Here I stand
And here I'll stay
Let the storm rage on
My power flurries through the air into the ground
My soul is spiraling in frozen fractals all around
And one thought crystallizes like an icy blast
I'm never going back, the past is in the past
Let it go, let it go
And I'll rise like the break of dawn
Let it go, let it go
That perfect girl is gone
Here I stand
In the light of day
Let the storm rage on
The cold never bothered me anyway!

Songwriters: Robert Lopez / Kristen Anderson-Lopez / Emanuel Kiriakou
Let It Go lyrics © Walt Disney Music Company



TX

So does that mean Let GO of my frustration of experiencing these a$$holes? Or to let go of the subject? Thanks to y'all, I feel I can now...... LMAO!!! :stupid: