D50 without sticker vs. with

Think about it, what's the cheapest, tackiest (mainly because of the pi$$poor penmanship) and largely insignificant (the guitar's vital info s/b stamped, burned, etched or some other way that's more permanent) thing on a guitar? The flippin" PAPER label!

I would never NOT buy a guitar that I positively knew was authentic because it didn't have a paper label. I think those labels are more for the mfg's and retailer's use, than anything else.

Did Rembrandt or Picasso stick a paper label to their Paintings and then sign it?

My D55 had a sticker on top of the sticker (seriously). Evidently the 2nd sticker, which had a bar code on it, was what marked the guitar as a factory second. (There was no big "2" on the back of the headstock or anything.) I suppose that a rather unscrupulous person could just take off both and pretend the original fell out or what have you to disguise it's provenance, so on some of the later Corona builds that might be something to think about (I'm talking about an '04 here).

This is the only pic I have, if I can adjust it to make it more clear later this evening I will and repost it. You can see the bar code extending out over the edge of the original sticker on the right.

rampside said:

Think about it, what's the cheapest, tackiest (mainly because of the pi$$poor penmanship) and largely insignificant (the guitar's vital info s/b stamped, burned, etched or some other way that's more permanent) thing on a guitar? The flippin" PAPER label!

I would never NOT buy a guitar that I positively knew was authentic because it didn't have a paper label. I think those labels are more for the mfg's and retailer's use, than anything else.

Did Rembrandt or Picasso stick a paper label to their Paintings and then sign it?

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One could argue it's part of the guitar's personality. But, again, that's just me.

adorshki said:

AS you can see from feedback..there was a period in which the sticker glue just seemed to be weak and they fell off.
I suspect that's what really happened and the owner just forgot, although there is that slight possibility it really never did get one, but I thought that was limited to the solid body electrics as in Frono's case.
Who knows what that does for the "purist" collector but as others mentioned the s/n on headstock should be all that's needed for proper ID.

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My guess Al is it was not so much glue but candle wax they used form the burning candles on the shop desks at Westerly. Like the old school wax they would use to seal envelopes when our republic first started.

tarheelguild said:

I know me, and it would've bugged me to no end, so I passed. Thoughts.....??

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tarheelguild, this is really the only thing that matters up there, since you buy a guitar for yourself.
Conclusion: You made the right decision for yourself.

As to the thoughts collection request, well.... I think you got the picture! layful:

tarheelguild said:

One could argue it's part of the guitar's personality. But, again, that's just me.

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Actually, I do somewhat agree. The older a guitar is, the more personality those labels give it. I just wish they wouldn't come off or become illegible. :smile:

rampside said:

Did Rembrandt or Picasso stick a paper label to their Paintings and then sign it?

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Kazuo Yairi signed all the guitars he made, or were made under his direction. He signed them on the label. roud: I do like best, however, when he had a small brand iron made of his signature, and he burned it into the top of a couple of his models, the DY72 12-string, for example.... :cool-new:

jim777 said:

My D55 had a sticker on top of the sticker (seriously). Evidently the 2nd sticker, which had a bar code on it, was what marked the guitar as a factory second. (There was no big "2" on the back of the headstock or anything.) I suppose that a rather unscrupulous person could just take off both and pretend the original fell out or what have you to disguise it's provenance, so on some of the later Corona builds that might be something to think about (I'm talking about an '04 here).

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You bring up an excellent point that I didn't go into in my first post:
The very slight possibility that a guitar didn't have the original neck, which could be easily determined if label and headstock s/n didn't match (Although we've even seen examples of that from Westerly)
It's conceivable an expert neck swap and re-finish could disguise that, although it's hard to conceive of a Guild that might be "worth" going to such extremes for, if the intent was to try to inflate the value of the instrument.
But some of the Hobokens are starting to show signs of it recently.
I do get the "purist collector" viewpoint though, even though most Guilds don't have an intrinsic "vintage collectible" value like the "other 2 guys".
But hey, if it was supposed to be there when it was built, then it ain't truly 100% original if it's missing.
And for us real hardcore guys, it's like Rampside said, it's part of the guitar's "personality".
But I wouldn't let it stop me either, for the right guitar.
Doesn't that Corona have the s/n on the back of the headstock defaced though?
That was supposed to be part of the security to ensure that even if the label DID fall off it would still be recognizable as "non-warranteed"
I assume from you description it was one of the guitars that was refurbished by MIRC. (Photo's too dark for me to see in the soundhole)

adorshki said:

But hey, if it was supposed to be there when it was built, then it ain't truly 100% original if it's missing.
And for us real hardcore guys, it's like Rampside said, it's part of the guitar's "personality".
)

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For me, I purchased my guitar without the sticker, so it IS part of it's personality.
It's not 100% original in the sticker, the frets, the finish is worn, and the truss rod cover is a later westerly model.
But, I love how it sounds and how it sounds. It's not going anywhere...

adorshki said:

The very slight possibility that a guitar didn't have the original neck, which could be easily determined if label and headstock s/n didn't match (Although we've even seen examples of that from Westerly)

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To veer, we have documented some 60's basses where the neck and the serial did not match and there is at least one Starfire bass serial number that has been seen on two different instruments: a Starfire I and a Starfire II. I remember things that did not happen but I am reasonably certain that Hans confirmed the duplicate serial number as opposed to a conversion.

The label on my '79 D40 fell off. I searched but couldn't find it until the luthier found it while doing a neck reset. I glued it back on. It promptly fell off again and re-glued itself down in the bowels of the guitar where it remains to this day.

At the time I had a fit, trying several times and failing to return it to its proper position.

I eventually got over it. It is what it is.

adorshki said:

Doesn't that Corona have the s/n on the back of the headstock defaced though?
That was supposed to be part of the security to ensure that even if the label DID fall off it would still be recognizable as "non-warranteed"
I assume from you description it was one of the guitars that was refurbished by MIRC. (Photo's too dark for me to see in the soundhole)

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I honestly don't remember if the serial number on the headstock was defaced, but I think I would have remembered that. My fuzzy memory of it is that the only serial number was on the bar code sticker, if so, I wouldn't have noticed a missing serial number as an issue because I wasn't a "Guild guy" at the time, I was an "Ibanez Jem" guy. I bought it because it was a guitar Tommy Smothers played, probably like a bunch of guys did lol. All the pics I have of it are here: http://jim777.com/images/D55/
and there aren't many and they aren't high quality. I will try to get a better version of that sound hole though soon.

Your D55 would fit well in my hands, Jim, with or without a label! eaceful:

My dos centavos,
Joe

killdeer43 said:

Your D55 would fit well in my hands, Jim, with or without a label! eaceful:

My dos centavos,
Joe

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Alas, she left the stable in about '08 but I am hunting for a burst one at the moment If I can somehow manage a D55 and another Guild non-dreadnaught with a cutaway I think I might be good for the rest of the year

fronobulax said:

To veer, we have documented some 60's basses where the neck and the serial did not match and there is at least one Starfire bass serial number that has been seen on two different instruments: a Starfire I and a Starfire II. I remember things that did not happen but I am reasonably certain that Hans confirmed the duplicate serial number as opposed to a conversion.

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I distinctly recall someone, Mavuser I think, confirming the comment from Hans that there was actually an accidental re-use of some s/n's.
I get fuzzy at this point but I believe it was some '60's numbers that got re-used after Fender takeover? Or maybe just in late '80's?

jim777 said:

I honestly don't remember if the serial number on the headstock was defaced, but I think I would have remembered that. My fuzzy memory of it is that the only serial number was on the bar code sticker, if so, I wouldn't have noticed a missing serial number as an issue because I wasn't a "Guild guy" at the time, I was an "Ibanez Jem" guy. I bought it because it was a guitar Tommy Smothers played, probably like a bunch of guys did lol. All the pics I have of it are here: http://jim777.com/images/D55/
and there aren't many and they aren't high quality. I will try to get a better version of that sound hole though soon.

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I think most of us "old hands" have seen pics of MIRC's barcode stickers, but it might be of interest to new members down the road.
Actually, it would be of interest if it looks like it's NOT an MIRC sticker.
Appreciate the feedback, and now you know what to look for if it comes up again.

adorshki said:

I distinctly recall someone, Mavuser I think, confirming the comment from Hans that there was actually an accidental re-use of some s/n's.
I get fuzzy at this point but I believe it was some '60's numbers that got re-used after Fender takeover? Or maybe just in late '80's?

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to my knowledge, what you wrote is essentially correct. maybe take out the part about the late 80s...gonna have to wait for Volume 2 for the real facts...yes vintage serial numbers were re-used accidentally 30-40 years later, not sure to what extent, but my understanding is that it was an accident

And also I have 1 Guild bass and 1 or 2 Guild amps with just a remnant of the torn off label. and a few Guild things with no label at all, and another Guild with a label covered in sloppy crayon intitials. some mint pieces as well, of course...as for the torn labels my thinking is they started to curl and possibly vibrate/make noise so someone went for the jugular.

mavuser said:

as for the torn labels my thinking is they started to curl and possibly vibrate/make noise so someone went for the jugular.

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Oh no, not the dreaded label buzz !!

adorshki said:

Oh no, not the dreaded label buzz !!

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Ah, that's where it went - the guy smoked it!!

walrus