As a Guild fan what would be your advice to the new owners of the brand?

capo12

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I was over on the AGF and saw a posting where it was mentioned that "at least the brand stays made in the USA" or something to that effect and it made me wonder what you guys that are long time Guild fans would like to see happen? What models do you think should stay or go or be re-introduced or if there is something new that should be addressed?
 

Neal

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I would like to see a reasonably-priced D-25 arch-back return to the domestic fold, given the popularity of the Westerly D-25's.

Neal
 

Westerly Wood

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I would like to see a reasonably-priced D-25 arch-back return to the domestic fold, given the popularity of the Westerly D-25's.

Neal

+1 to this Neal. I think you should be in charge of production.
 

Neal

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What New Hartford lacked was an "every man's" American Guild that was within reach of those seeking a US alternative to the GAD's and Archos.
 

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And the impediment to that was the Arcos series itself. You can't have a run of lower-priced guitars that competes with your own product. NH was capable of far more than it was allowed to do.
 

fronobulax

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I would advise them to clearly articulate to the market, consumers and distributors whether their brand strategy is to continue as a low production volume boutique instrument maker or whether they intend to produce Guilds in such volumes that the days of a Guild for everyone return. Much of the angst I observe on LTG about New Hartford production was rooted in a a belief that the brand strategy was (or should be) Guild as everyone's alternative to Martin and Gibson. I personally don't think that has been true since the 1970's but it would be nice to know whether that is the vision or not. As much love as there is for a D-25 that is not a product of a low volume boutique maker, IMO.

I would also be curious as to how they intend to address the strong competition from vintage instruments. My advice would be to aim for a price point (MSRP) so that the street price of a new instrument was within $500 of the equivalent vintage instrument in VG to Excellent condition. That, of course, assume they have the ability to build new ones that as just as fine as vintage instruments.

Perhaps more in the spirit of the question, Guild has always been competitive in the 12 market when it did not dominate so I would advise that the first or second model produced would be a 12 so that the brand can continue that reputation and not have to rebuild it because new 12's have been off the market for so long that people forget.
 

billder99

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It has really struck me how much people here on LTG love the D-25 archback in all it's forms... isn't that what they are already doing with the Arcos line? It will be interesting to see what happens with Arcos there in Ensenada.

My #1: If Cordoba wants to build guitars, they have lots of options for where they go... but if Cordoba wants to do the right thing, then they should either restart the New Hartford plant or offer good relocation packages to their most important New Hartford builders. I've seen the jabs at Oxnard, but the truth is that whole area is quite a nice place to live... beautiful beaches right next to the Malibu coast, just down from Santa Barbara, the Los Padres wilderness for hiking and backpacking, just an hour from LA, 1-1/2 hours to snow skiing in Big Bear, and So Cal weather... what's not to like? (except for the cost of living... the big drawback to So Cal)

My #2: Keep Ren and Orpheum, set them up in Montana if he and his team wish it... continue seeking to build the best steel string guitars on the planet.
 
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griehund

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My first concern is how they will view this group? The line that separates advocate and adversary is the same line that separates asset and liability. I must assume they know we are here. Is there a formal introductory protocol? LMG Oxnard? There are infinitely more questions than answers. When we met the people at NH our relationships became personal. Will we have an effect on decision making? How?

Now my head is spinning. Optimistically confused.:confused:
 

SFIV1967

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It will be interesting to see what happens with Arcos there in Ensenada.
If I would have a say I would discontinue the whole Arcos line ASAP. Just created confusion in the marketplace. If (and we don't know that) the Newark St. line will continue under Guild I think CMG is well prepared for distribution of them. It might be not a problem to continue using the Korea factory making them. Regarding the GADs I have my concerns if Guild really need them at all, but looking in the current CMG models they seem to be happy with distribution of China made instruments, so maybe they just leave it running as it is. I would assume they start some Traditional models and maybe some Standard models again in Oxnard, that leaves the American Patriarch and Orpheum lines now. Starting a second workshop for them in Montana? Well, why not. We will see in a few month I guess...
Ralf
 

plaidseason

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I wholly agree with returning the D25 to the lineup. And maybe even the D35. Ditch the ARCOS and the the GAD stuff. It would be amazing if they could keep New Hartford open, but my guess/bet is that they're hoping to move take the whole thing in-house.

This new really freaked me out at first, but now I kind of wonder if this isn't the best possible outcome (given how bleak things seemed).

-Chris
 

Westerly Wood

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I cannot really speak for electrics, but what I would do would be:

kill arcos and gad
focus on US production only
Arched back D25s 1000 price range
D35 in 1000 range
D40 1500-1700
D55 2000
F212 1000, 412 2000 and 512 2500
Orpheum for the higher end 3000

no doubt, I would be out of business fast but it sure would be a blast.
 

Watasha

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I cannot really speak for electrics, but what I would do would be:

kill arcos and gad
focus on US production only
Arched back D25s 1000 price range
D35 in 1000 range
D40 1500-1700
D55 2000
F212 1000, 412 2000 and 512 2500
Orpheum for the higher end 3000

no doubt, I would be out of business fast but it sure would be a blast.

Sign me up for that $2k D55 & $1k F212!

I think they keep the GAD line as I expect that makes a fair amount of money & it will be the line least affected by this transition. I expect they might consolidate to some degree, circle the wagons & then start to build it back up. I'm just stoked that Guild is owned by a friggin' GUITAR COMPANY.
 

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In that lineup, the D-35 is odd man out. D-25 for the low end. Build killer 12 strings in hog, maple and rosewood. Build a killer D-55. Have a generous dealer policy with a small buy requirement. Get the D-25, D-4s, whatever, out of the VIP room. Have the higher end stuff there, so you can say to people "you think that's good, try THIS!

Get them out to the hands of the people!
 
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Interesting mixture of business observations and wishful thinking here. As lovely as it would be to recreate some earlier stage of the American guitar world--one in which a Guild was an economically and aesthetically competitive alternative to one of the other two American manufacturers of pro-level guitars--them days is gone. When I bought my D-40 off the wall of a music store in 1967, it was partly an economic decision: that guitar was, to my ear, as good as the Martins I had access to and much better than the Gibsons, and it was a notch or two more affordable. ($250, as I recall.) There were Japanese instruments around--Yamahas were decent and even more affordable. The other possibility for a while might have been a Kay or Harmony--American-made but several steps in quality below even the cheapest Guild. (The D-40 was a replacement for a Kay N-1. It was a different universe of playability.) That situation for amateur pickers continued until Asian manufacturing figured out how to produce a good-enough acoustic guitar for entry-level and casual players.

Cut to the last few years: If I were a 22-year-old of modest means in need of a good-sounding, well-built acoustic instrument, I would not be looking at any new US-built guitar.* For much less in constant dollars, I could buy a Chinese-built guitar that is at least as good as any entry-level instrument of the 1960s or 70s and worlds better than, say, the Takamines that (to my mind) represent the swarms of Asian guitars that once occupied the low end of the market.

The laminate/archback Guilds that many remember fondly were designed less for their sound than for ease and affordability of manufacture. (Recall that Guild started as a builder of archtops and already had the machinery to produce the laminate components.) Note that after 1959, the upper end of the Guild flat-top line went to solid flat-back design, with the archbacks occupying the lower price tier. Those archback dreads did have their own sonic virtues, and I'm guessing that the economics of production and warranty-service encouraged arched backs on the big 12-strings. And, after all, Guild still had the specialized equipment to make their own laminated backs, so why not use it? Resurrecting the archback flat-top in a new facility would mean resurrecting (or recreating) that production gear, and given the economics of USian manufacturing, I don't see that as a realistic possibility. Now, there are probably plenty of Asian factories that can turn out laminate backs in quantity at very low unit prices. . . .

* On edit, a second thought: I would seriously consider a North American instrument in the form of a Seagull. Miraculous bang for the buck there, and an option for those who have moral or political objections to Chinese factories.
 
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The reason for the arched back love is the increase in volume. Yeah, it cost less to make, but D-25s were know for being cannons. Make it out of cherry or some other quality non-exotic wood. Most importantly, make it sound good. You are 't going to be building for the entry level, you will be duking it out with the $699 Taylor 12 Strings at Sam Ash.


Russel, if they want arched backs, they own several Chinese(or contract to) factories. If they want to do an American arched back, all they have to do is order the press. If it doesn't come with the Guild assets already. ;-)
 
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Neal

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Wouldn't Cordoba need a laminate press to produce the F-50 and F-412? I couldn't see either of those two models going away, and I definitely can't see them changing the design of those maple beauties to flat-back.

Or, is the dreadnought laminated back made on a different press than the jumbos?

Neal
 

Chaz

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Add me to the list that thinks the D25 and D35 should make a comeback. IMO, as it is they are playing to the well-established high end market without a lot of marketing or brand awareness. I don't think Guitar Center/MF really carried any Guild stuff, did they? I never saw any in GC around here. The girl that worked there when I bought my D25 said she thought they were cool, but they never got any besides occasional used stuff. I think in a lot of towns, the GC/MF Wal-Mart format means that they will be one of the few places that sell upper-end stuff IME.

So, forgetting the lack of actual guitars to buy, consider what people will be comparing to; stuff like the Martin D-28, etc. Everyone on the planet knows what those are, and everyone loves them. But hey, check out this Guild over here for the same price! Or don't, because why would you? I think that's a large part of the problem. I picked up a beat to hell flatback D25 years ago in a music store and thought it was the best sounding guitar I'd ever picked up/heard; as a result of that, I sought out Guild stuff later on. Much like that original guitar, I've really liked the ones I've picked up since then, and I absolutely love the archback D25 I ended up with. I'd say that if I was buying a new high-end guitar that the NH Guild stuff would certainly have been a contender, because my past experience with the brand has been great.

But, if you're just a guy on the street who's never picked one up before, why would you feel compelled to? The D-28 is considered to be a kind of ultimate acoustic guitar by many, so why go through the trouble to pay the same amount for an "imitation"? We all are here because we like them, but in this day and age Guild isn't a household name; Martin (etc.) is, and many tout them as being the best. So, why seek out something else?

That's why I think the lower end models would be a good idea. The market for cheaper US-built guitars seems pretty good right now, and at that lower price point I think you'd get a lot more guitars in stores, and a lot more people trying them out and buying them as a result. (The GAD series seems to have garnered a little mainstream interest even just being another made in China guitar.) Then, once you've started selling those and re-established the brand a little, you'd probably also have much better luck selling the higher end models. That's my thought, anyway.

(BTW, I apologize in advance for spelling/thinking errors contained in this rambling post.)
 

SFIV1967

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Wouldn't Cordoba need a laminate press to produce the F-50 and F-412?
Right, what's the problem? They could/would get it from the factory in NH. Assuming they bought all the factory equipment from NH.

I don't think Guitar Center/MF really carried any Guild stuff, did they?
I think it was mentioned a zillion times at LTG that NH produced about 3000 guitars a year and GC would have required much more to even stock all the GCs, hence FMIC decided that only Sam Ash should carry Guilds (as also Sam Ash personally loved Guild). Also GC and FMIC's fate were directly connected, so stocking GC with more FMIC product would have had a negative result I think. But even Sam Ash only carried a few in a few selected stores. GC however was allowed to carry GADs, they had them available via their webpage but not many in store at all.

Ralf
 
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