Does this look like a Magnatone to anybody else?

If so, what sort of model do you figure and what's it worth?





Part of a CL add for random stuff some guys is trying to trade for vintage low-end guitars...

Looks like a couple long skinny power tubes (EL84?, obscure something-or-others?) and looks like the outline of a couple small oval speakers at the top of the grille cloth.

If you haven't guessed by now, I'm pretty ignorant of Magnatone stuff...

Yes, it looks like one to me. They manufactured under different brand names at times. That one looks to say "Noble" on it. I don't recognize that but everything else about it looks like a Maggie. It also might say "Unique" which was another brand name they used.

This site will help you out... http://www.vibroworld.com/magnatone/archive.html

It might be a 460 or 480 model from the early 60's. I don't know what it would be worth... under $1k I suppose. But it is one of the big boys.

MrBoZiffer said:

It might be a 460 or 480 model from the early 60's. I don't know what it would be worth... under $1k I suppose. But it is one of the big boys.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the tip. Knob array seems to match the 480. I should probably stop thinking about this one, since I'm in selling mode right now...

Link to a good Magnatone webpage; lots of schematics and pics

http://www.vibroworld.com/magnatone/index.html


The skinny power tubes are probably 7189s ... no longer in production but same / similar(?) pinouts to EL84s.

These days, my interest in amps diminishes by the pound.

Starting in the early '60s, things got confusing at Magnatone. They continued introducing new amps and putting out the old ones, but also started manufacturing rebranded versions of their top amps, and later licensing models out for manufacture elsewhere.

This looks like a 280A, stereo with no reverb. The only rebranded 280 I could find was the Pac Amp 382. This apparently is another one. My guess is 62 - 64 range, but only a guess. Has the later knobs. Zack's Vibroworld is still the most complete resource I know of:

http://www.vibroworld.com/magnatone/archive.html

Still, outlying brands and models pop up. Magnatone/Estey was clearing doing any deal they could back then. Hard to tell at a glance exactly what's in this amp. Whereas my Twilighter 260 differed from the original Magnatone only in the lack of a sub-chassis and different cosmetics, some later models used different power tubes, took other liberties with component values.
MD

Just picked this sucker up for $250 cash. Works flawlessly, but has original tubes and probably all original everything, which means it could fail at any time.

Still, until it does, it ought to be fun....

That sounds like a good deal. Congrats!

I've got a Maggie 213 that is mostly original. I reconed the original speaker, installed a new multi-cap can, and put in some NOS tubes. Besides those things everything else is original and it sounds great. I feel like Maggie's were pretty well built.

Enjoy!

Took a brief look at it, but haven't opened it up or started cleaning. One side has covering missing and peeling up and a chip of wood came off the cabinet from that spot, so it need some glue reinforcement.

Most of the tubes are turned around so that their #s are obscured. They're all dust-caked. Power tubes are original Estey-branded, has some stumpy Telefunken EC8?s and some 12AX7-sized GEs. Bottle-shaped rectifier has no visible markings as mounted and is the largest tube I've seen installed in an amp...

I notice what appears to be the cutout for a can-cap that's got a single, shiny screw in one corner and what looks like the edge of a metal-wrapped cap just peeking visible through the hole, so I'm interested to see what kind of buggery is up inside. There is a skinny can-cap in place elsewhere on the chassis, so who knows...

Still has a two prong plug, but my 1947 house has 2-wire wiring throughout anyway, so no added danger until I take it somewhere I'd have the benefit of grounded outlets, lol.

I will promise pics of inside and out in the next couple days.

Here's some quick pics (on lunch break right now...). There's definitely something going on inside the (presumably) capacitor cutout. Also, the giant rectifier is Russian and I think it's the reason the back panel is missing; it sticks out so far I can tell it would interfere w/ the panel if it was in place...

No tube chart whatsoever. The other tubes are all original/period.

Cosmetically, it looks awesome! Maybe someone removed the cap can and put some filter caps inside the chassis. Have you looked inside yet? How does it sound?

MrBoZiffer said:

Cosmetically, it looks awesome! Maybe someone removed the cap can and put some filter caps inside the chassis. Have you looked inside yet? How does it sound?

Click to expand...

Yeah, I should have taken a pic of the water damaged bottom edge, but it's only on one side. Other than that and the missing knob inserts and back panel, it's really pretty clean. There are virtually no dings, dents or gouges, so it's not been hauled around a lot. My guess is that it sat in a garage for a long time.

I suspect that it's been at least partially recapped. That's what looks like is going on inside the "hole," at least. I'm dying to open it up and see what's up inside, but haven't gotten the time to yet.

Functionally, it sounds pretty lively and is very quiet, the vibrato works, etc., so I'm thinking that it's seen a little attention. Who knows, though...

very cool amp

Congratulations K; did good! The speakers are Oxfords (scroll down) and the two caps fastened to the baffleboard are the crossovers for the two tweeters in the top of the baffle.

Agree; looks like something used to live in the one hole but that one multi-section can cap could have served the one power supply that feeds both amps ... who knows ... looking forward to more pics. 8)

capnjuan said:

Congratulations K; did good! The speakers are Oxfords (scroll down) and the two caps fastened to the baffleboard are the crossovers for the two tweeters in the top of the baffle.

Agree; looks like something used to live in the one hole but that one multi-section can cap could have served the one power supply that feeds both amps ... who knows ... looking forward to more pics. 8)

Click to expand...

Yeah, something's definitely up there. (really need to open this sucker up and take lotsa pics...) You can see less tarnished metal in a circle around where the old stacked cap used to mount, there's a shiny sheet metal screw through one corner of the original mounting slots and you can see that that connects on the inside to a brown circuit board and a metal-shrouded cap connects to that. I assume the circuit board is a means of connecting individual caps to cover what was once stacked...

The fact that that was done w/ at least some care gives me a bit of hope for what might be inside, but it could still be a bunch of spaghetti dead-end original wires, etc.

I figured the caps must be crossovers, since they connect in line with the speakers. Kind of cool how they enclosed the oval speakers with the chassis and left the 12s open back. So, as crossovers, do the easy to inadvertently touch crossover caps carry significant stored voltage?

Oh, and the model name (SYMPHONIC M990) and "brand" (DON NOBLE CO. INC. CHICAGO..) is all part of one long emboss-a-plastic-strip label maker tape, lol.

There's a small sticker with model and serial number in the bottom of the cabinet. Model number is 381, which matches that Tonemaster 381 on the vibroworld site that visually matches this. Interestingly, though, though the control panel and cabinet are 100% the same, the arrangement of tubes is totally different.

kakerlak said:

.. I figured the caps must be crossovers, since they connect in line with the speakers ... So, as crossovers, do the easy to inadvertently touch crossover caps carry significant stored voltage? ... There's a small sticker with model and serial number in the bottom of the cabinet. Model number is 381, which matches that Tonemaster 381 on the vibroworld site that visually matches this.

Click to expand...

Hi K: not to worry with the cross-over caps. They are being used to block certain frequencies from reaching one or the other pair of speakers; either the high frequency from reaching the woofers or vice versa ... the low frequency from reaching the tweeters ... no energy being stored.

I think your amp most closely matches the Magnatone 480 ... a reverb/stereo amp. For example; your chassis compared to the Maggie 480 schematic. The only mismatches are that your amp doesn't have a twin-triode 6DR7 that the Maggie uses for reverb drive ... and the missing can cap near the rectifier:



Your amp may also have 12AX7s and not 6EU7s for preamp tubes; same tubes but with different pinouts.

This is the heart and soul of the Maggies ... the proprietary pitch-shifting vibrato including one 1/2 of the 12DW7 (a/k/a 7247). Those are the varistors highlighted (am also accounting for the tubes in the Vibroworld description; 6CG7 shown):




Finally the tremolo/oscillator ... bumps volume - not pitch - up and down and shows the 12BH7 also mentioned in the Vibroworld description and the other half of the 12DW7:



You didn't mention whether it came with a footswitch; if not, any standard on/off FS will do. I think there's at least one replacement cap showing through the old hole in the chassis; many/most of the old can caps are no longer available but a good tech can get around by finding homes for individual caps. The 480 schematic indicates 390V on the plates and fixed bias. If yours also has fixed bias, the rated output is 25 watts per pair/channel or 50 watts of sweet Maggie sound. 8)

John:

I didn't see a reverb pan in the pic ... are you sure this amp has reverb?

MD

mad dog said:

John:

I didn't see a reverb pan in the pic ... are you sure this amp has reverb?

MD

Click to expand...

This amp does not have reverb (a damned shame...) but I think what John was saying is that the chassis matches that one's layout with the exception of reverb-related components.

What's weird is that the control panel layout and model number match the Tonemaster 381 100%, but the tubes on the underside are all in completely different places.

kakerlak said:

mad dog said:

John: I didn't see a reverb pan in the pic ... are you sure this amp has reverb? MD

Click to expand...

This amp does not have reverb (a damned shame...) but I think what John was saying is that the chassis matches that one's layout with the exception of reverb-related components. What's weird is that the control panel layout and model number match the Tonemaster 381 100%, but the tubes on the underside are all in completely different places.

Click to expand...

Hi Michael and K; yes, that's it ... the tube layout - in type and physical orientation - matches the 480 but without reverb. Even when Zack's Maggie Page was active, I don't think the subject of licensing and any limits / requirements on licensees ever got discussed. As far as this 'Noble' amp goes; the 'Nobles' might have bought semi-finished chassis from Magnatone and stuck them in their own cabinets ... I mean I don't know how much latitude licensees had in duping Maggie models. Looking forward to some chassis shots when they're available.