fretless M-85

bassman10096

Junior Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2008
Messages
86
Reaction score
26
OK, so after that veer, I'm going to post this again...




...and wonder - how much of the sound is A) the strings (LaBella Deep Talkin' flatwounds), B) the electronics (Alembic), C) the bass (including scale length, body & neck wood), and/or D) the wooden saddles? Actually, the pick may be a significant part of the equation. Obviously it's a combination of all these factors and more, but I do wonder if the sound would change significantly with metal saddles for example, or an Alembic style bridge. For now, I'm going with if it ain't broke, don't fix it!

You certainly copped a whole lot fo Phil there. My highest compliments to your play and interpretation. I think the technical side is about as close as it needs. IMHO, LaBellas have become (over the years) just about as articulate as the Pyramids Phil played back in the day. As much as I like current-day Pyramid flats, I really have a harder time getting to Phil’s tones than I do with LaBellas.
i think the rosewood bridge saddles are sort of extraneous. Short of an Alembic bridge, you could switch to metal saddles or a reissue, Fender-style harp bridge (metal, threaded saddles for easy intonation) if you wanted. Even though these probably won’t get quite as metallic-gritty as Phil sometimes sounded your playing landed the feel and timbre, if not the precise sound the notes.
Nice job!!!
 
Last edited:

hieronymous

Member
Joined
Jul 21, 2007
Messages
415
Reaction score
125
Location
Northern CA
Guild Total
1
Nice. I've found that choice of pick definitely makes a difference. These days, on bass, I only use Tortex picks around 1mm thickness. On guitar I'm a little less picky (pun 100% intended) and will switch between standard medium picks up to the thicker Tortex ones depending on my mood, what song I'm playing, or what's closest by.

Interesting - my standard pick of late has been the Dunlop Tortex 1.14mm - the purple ones. I was using graphite for several years (the triangular Telefunken and the Adamas graphite - 2mm!

u sound great man! do u think there is any way to get the Harry-lembic pickups in a GSR M-85, but somehow have the battery and whatever else be external (since there is no control cavity in a fully hollow GSR M-85)?

Good question - you would have to contact Alembic directly. That could be cool, like have a connector on the bass, maybe where the regular output jack would be, but with some kind of multi-pin connector that would connect to a box that attached to your strap or on the amp?

You certainly copped a whole lot fo Phil there. My highest compliments to your play and interpretation. I think the technical side is about as close as it needs. IMHO, LaBellas have become (over the years) just about as articulate as the Pyramids Phil played back in the day. As much as I like current-day Pyramid flats, I really have a harder time getting to Phil’s tones than I do with LaBellas.
i think the rosewood bridge saddles are sort of extraneous. Short of an Alembic bridge, you could switch to metal saddles or a reissue, Fender-style bridge (easy intonation) if you wanted. Even though these probably won’t get quite as metallic-gritty as Phil sometimes sounded your playing landed the feel and timbre, if not the precise sound the notes.
Nice job!!!

Thanks! I have never tried Pyramids myself. I've been experimenting with GHS Precision Flats on my Gibson Les Paul Triumph Bass, but only ever used the LaBellas on this one.

I actually have a set of metal saddles, but I'm waiting until I actually need them before having them installed. I think my G-string saddle is a replacement, and wasn't grooved (? can't think of the right verb) very well, but it works and I don't notice. If the other three are original, then they're 50 years old this year! Not sure where it's lived before, but it's been with me in the SF Bay Area for about 10 years so not as extreme if it was in New England or someplace like that.
 

bassman10096

Junior Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2008
Messages
86
Reaction score
26
Again. Nice playing. Although I heard of Pyramids first in relation to Phil and (I think) Jack back in the day, I actually use them on my P basses. Once they wear in, they have agreat vintage flat sound with nice mids.
Unfortunately they are very stiff at the tuner end, so you have to be careful winding the lower strings if your tuners have smaller capstans (like Gotohs) vs wider capstans like Fender and Guild.
Pyramids flats cost more but they hold their own against other flats
 

bassman10096

Junior Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2008
Messages
86
Reaction score
26
Interesting - my standard pick of late has been the Dunlop Tortex 1.14mm - the purple ones. I was using graphite for several years (the triangular Telefunken and the Adamas graphite - 2mm!



Good question - you would have to contact Alembic directly. That could be cool, like have a connector on the bass, maybe where the regular output jack would be, but with some kind of multi-pin connector that would connect to a box that attached to your strap or on the amp?



Thanks! I have never tried Pyramids myself. I've been experimenting with GHS Precision Flats on my Gibson Les Paul Triumph Bass, but only ever used the LaBellas on this one.

I actually have a set of metal saddles, but I'm waiting until I actually need them before having them installed. I think my G-string saddle is a replacement, and wasn't grooved (? can't think of the right verb) very well, but it works and I don't notice. If the other three are original, then they're 50 years old this year! Not sure where it's lived before, but it's been with me in the SF Bay Area for about 10 years so not as extreme if it was in New England or someplace like that.
I think a competent luthier should be able to file the G saddle to properly align with the others and to intonate perfectly.
 

Happy Face

Justified Ancient of MuMu
Joined
Dec 11, 2007
Messages
916
Reaction score
239
u sound great man! do u think there is any way to get the Harry-lembic pickups in a GSR M-85, but somehow have the battery and whatever else be external (since there is no control cavity in a fully hollow GSR M-85)?
Mgod should speak up and correct me, but I believe that the early Char-lembics had external power supplies. So probably doable. Perhaps...
 

RVBASS

Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2020
Messages
200
Reaction score
276
Location
Massachusetts
Guild Total
3
Sounds great, Hieronymous, both the playing and tone!

Mavuser, Alembic might be able to install a five pin for external power with a DS-5 if you have them do the pickups and electronics, they did that for my Starfire.
 

hieronymous

Member
Joined
Jul 21, 2007
Messages
415
Reaction score
125
Location
Northern CA
Guild Total
1
I should mention that @edwin turned me on to the graphite picks - both the Telefunken & Adamas. I have since bought my own, they are both still available as far as I know.

This was an interesting exercise - there are times when a certain pick feels right, switching to a different one kind of kills the vibe. Listening back there may not be that much difference in sound, but the feel has a big impact on my playing.
 

hieronymous

Member
Joined
Jul 21, 2007
Messages
415
Reaction score
125
Location
Northern CA
Guild Total
1
I've been messing around with electronic music for a few months - got the Moog DFAM (drummer from another mother) & Subharmonicon to help me make soundscapes to play my bass along with. Recently I incorporated my AleM-85 for a contest at a synthesizer forum, and in the meantime came up with this:



You can only see the bass a couple of times (and only the back of the headstock), but I like the mood of the piece and thought it was worth posting here. I'm running both pickups, with the bridge pickup frequency boosted to try and get some different sounds out of the envelope filter (Moogerfooger MF-101 lowpass filter), which I then EQ'd a bit. The envelope is also triggering the Subharmonicon sequencer to play - it didn't necessarily do what I was expecting it to do (and this recording is my experimenting trying to figure out what it's doing) but I like what it's doing, it was fun to play along with it as much as it was playing along with me...
 

hieronymous

Member
Joined
Jul 21, 2007
Messages
415
Reaction score
125
Location
Northern CA
Guild Total
1
Hieronymous, the bass and synth sounds are fantastic! :)
Thanks! Was nice to use the fretless like this, wasn't the sound I usually go for, so was nice to experiment, especially with the Moog filter. It being fretless with flats, it doesn't necessarily have the high & mid frequencies that a fretted bass would, or rounds, though I did try and set the Alembic filter where the Moog filter would have something to work with. The Moog filter is such an interesting color, and that's really what I was boosting with the eq (my trusty old brown BOSS PQ-3B parametric eq).

I'm still learning the Moog - need to experiment with incorporating the sub-octaves, and also more eq & effects.
 
Top