Tonequest article

capnjuan said:

"...Gonna take you higher ...." Sylvester Stone. Killer Supro S6450; reverb/trem, twin 12" speakers. $2,025 / Auction Link Although this one is near-mint, these were +/- $1,500 a year ago.

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Okay,
This is just absurd! I almost pulled the trigger on one of these a little over a year ago for just under $600. I'm quite sadly getting tired of the vintage amp market.

Actually I've been really impressed by two relatively new amps that are so affordable, I may dump some of my herd to score one. The Crate V16 Palomino---15 watts, Class A, (3)12AX7s, (2)EL84s, spring reverb--great sounding, versatile amp. Could stand a tighter speaker. Also I'm astounded at the Vox AC15CC--this one's got me sold. Sparkly, jangly. . . you know Britishy Voxy (in reality actually Chinesey). Amazing presence and touch dynamics. I have to get one.

jp said:

... Okay, This is just absurd! I almost pulled the trigger on one of these a little over a year ago for just under $600. I'm quite sadly getting tired of the vintage amp market.

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A couple weeks ago, somebody suggested the price push on vintage amps was being driven by stock market refugees - I poo-pooed the idea .... now I'm not so sure. I do think that some of this is people wanting top-grade vintage but without paying Fender prices. If this keeps up, the price differential will be gone.

capnjuan said:

jp said:

... Okay, This is just absurd! I almost pulled the trigger on one of these a little over a year ago for just under $600. I'm quite sadly getting tired of the vintage amp market.

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A couple weeks ago, somebody suggested the price push on vintage amps was being driven by stock market refugees - I poo-pooed the idea .... now I'm not so sure. I do think that some of this is people wanting top-grade vintage but without paying Fender prices. If this keeps up, the price differential will be gone.

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I wonder as well capn. There's so much misinformation out there as well that has legitimized what we used to call junk. I think this especially applies to the loosely applied label--lawsuit--many poorly executed copies floating around with vintage mystique and prices to match. I think it's because many dealers without the deep coffers and knowledge to deal in the real are looking for quick flips. On the other hand, it is giving some overlooked historical gems a rebirth.

To all the fine young hipster musicians who happen to consume at the perfect price point, I say, Caveat Emptor!

jp said:

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I see your point; the back wheels don't match the front one. :lol:

Mint Julip if there ever was one; museum-grade condition. Tweed Fender Vibrolux $6,455 Here

capnjuan said:

Mint Julip if there ever was one; museum-grade condition. Tweed Fender Vibrolux $6,455 Here

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Holy CRAP!

Hi James; if any of us wants one of these, we better start hanging on to the tips from our paper routes .... Like ocean-front real estate; nobody's making any more of 'em.

They've suddenly floated into the realm of the untouchable, like a 60s Strats and LPs. Nuts!

.."..his clothes are dirty but his hands are clean..."

+/- 1958 Gibson GA40 .. tatted on the outside, pristine control panel, stock electronics, and Jensen 'Blue Bell' speaker to get the word out. $1,285.

For reference, here's my well-worn GA40:



Not sure of the year. Tattered tweed on the bottom, leather top. Everything stock but for a replacement speaker. I paid (actually traded) 850.00 worth maybe 5 years ago. No job at the time, so it was a foolish move. But for the tone. That's the point. When you hear one this good, rational thought is no longer possible.

Hi Michael; thank you for the pic - you mentioned you have a late-model RI Fender that you're happy with; any chance you could compare / contrast the tone of the GA40 and your recent Fender? CJ

CJ:

Let's see. The Gibson's not that close to anything else. Compared to Fender tweeds, it might be closest to the big-box tweed tremolux or maybe early Pro. The GA-40 reminds me of the tremolux mostly in that they both use the large cabinet. It makes a big difference in how big the sound feels, compared to a GA20 on the Gibson side, to a regular tweed deluxe on the Fender side. The other similarity is the wattage, and the 6v6s.

The similarities only go so far. The GA40 has a dark, hot sound, swirly and alive. West coast hot, jazzy too. Not much clean, and bear in mind I'm hearing mine through an efficient ceramic, the Weber Cali paperdome. The amp itself is compression rich, so I can do without early alnico breakup. The clean you do get is so rich, dense, and the overdriven tone is not easy to describe. VG called it "chocolate thunder" ... funny but somehow appropriate.

By contrast, the Fender RI tweed twin is predictably the much larger, louder sounding amp. It has wonderful clean tones, not the spare clean of BF/SF, meatier, way more mids. With more headroom than any other tweed except the later bassman. Due in part to that 2 rectifier tube set up. Which somehow makes the amp uniquely responsive while at the same time boosting headroom. How'd they do that?? In responsiveness and richness of tone -- especially overdriven -- it has some similarity to the GA40. But this one gets way LOUDER.

Very interesting article, and that victoria amp looks good enough to *eat*, but I really have to wonder who has around $3000 to spend on a fifteen watt 1X12 amp that hardly has any clean headroom whatsoever.....

mad dog said:

CJ:... The Gibson's not that close to anything else.

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Thank you Michael; no wonder then that people shell out for them. CJ

Walter Broes said:

... but I really have to wonder who has around $3000 to spend on a fifteen watt 1X12 amp that hardly has any clean headroom whatsoever.....

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Hi Walter ... do not have any idea ... but I do hope the better boutiques stick around long enough so that their used amps come down in price ... maybe. CJ

True. Second hand Victoria tweeds are "within reach", so I guess we'll just have to be patient...

There is a renovated Gibson GA40 on eBay, auction link here: Buffalo Amps / GA40. The auction discusses how the seller, who is Buffalo Amps - a micro-boutique, came by the amp and what he did with it. The auction contains several links to samples of the amp's tone. Due to the seller's acknowledged playing limitations and record / upload / download shortcomings, the samples might not be the best grade but they hint at the GA40's tone power Michael was describing in his earlier post. CJ

A very rare Gibson GA2RT on eBay. Perhaps as few as 400 made/shipped. This is the 2-channel 'Maestro' version of the Gibson GA19RVT. Uses three 6EU7s and a 12A?7 in the preamp, 2X6V6 out, 5Y3 rectifier Schematic Here. FS-operated reverb and tremolo; this one looks to have a Jensen P12R speaker and at least one Gibson-branded tube. Could have been the speaker but my GA19RVT was pretty 'dark' and because of my 12AX7-driven GA18, something I laid off on the 6EU7s. VGC, knobs not original, seller asking $1,000 opening bid; will get that and more. This model has a cousin, the 'Maestro' 216 in the later gray tolex; the last 216 I saw on eBay went for nearly $1,400. :shock:

Help me understand "headroom" please. Is it the amount of volume you can get before the amp distorts?
Pardon me exposing my ignorance.

capnjuan said:

A very rare Gibson GA2RT on eBay. Perhaps as few as 400 made/shipped. This is the 2-channel 'Maestro' version of the Gibson GA19RVT. Uses three 6EU7s and a 12A?7 in the preamp, 2X6V6 out, 5Y3 rectifier Schematic Here. FS-operated reverb and tremolo; this one looks to have a Jensen P12R speaker and at least one Gibson-branded tube. Could have been the speaker but my GA19RVT was pretty 'dark' and because of my 12AX7-driven GA18, something I laid off on the 6EU7s. VGC, knobs not original, seller asking $1,000 opening bid; will get that and more. This model has a cousin, the 'Maestro' 216 in the later gray tolex; the last 216 I saw on eBay went for nearly $1,400. :shock:

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Saw this one too, capn. Always been curious about this little branch of the Gibson amp family. Would love to test drive them sometime.

Guildmark said:

Help me understand "headroom" please. Is it the amount of volume you can get before the amp distorts?
Pardon me exposing my ignorance.

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That's the classic sound engineering definition, and I've always applied it to amps as well. However, I've heard it applied by some to define the raw power output of an amp as well.