Snow Pics

kitniyatran

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capnjuan said:
Tim said:
Thought some of you guys down south (cj, west) would like to see what christmas looks like up here in the north. Enjoy.
Hi Tim: as the song lyric goes: "Thanks For The Memories". I really do miss the fair, crisp weather of fall; but that's about it. I sure don't miss the shoveling, chipping, slipping, and sliding .... but it is very, very pretty. cj

I went home to Maryland for a week & 1/2 at Tanksgiven, & Froze!(temps in maybe the 30's to 50's?) I Don't miss it a bit!
 

Mr_LV-19E

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Nice pic's tim, I just drove 5 hours in that $#@%. The pictures are much nicer than the reality.
 

West R Lee

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We haven't seen that much snow in my lifetime here, but that's only 50 years. The most I remember here was 4". Sometimes it goes years here without a flake. It is beautiful, I wouldn't want to contend with it all the time though.

West
 

Frosty

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cjd-player said:
So this whole global warming thing doen't seem to be working eh? Well wat'ya expect for something Al Gore thought up. :roll:

I have to say, I just don't understand why anyone would choose to mock the idea of global warming. I know what cdj-player has posted is more of a shot at Al Gore than climate change, and I'm not going to touch that since I believe in the separation of music and state. But global warming is *not* something about which I want the scientific community to have the last laugh over the naysayers.
 

cjd-player

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Frosty said:
cjd-player said:
So this whole global warming thing doen't seem to be working eh? Well wat'ya expect for something Al Gore thought up. :roll:

I have to say, I just don't understand why anyone would choose to mock the idea of global warming. I know what cdj-player has posted is more of a shot at Al Gore than climate change, and I'm not going to touch that since I believe in the separation of music and state. But global warming is *not* something about which I want the scientific community to have the last laugh over the naysayers.


Hi Frosty, I'm sympathetic to what you say, I certainly don't want to start any arguments, and I try to keep an open mind about this but... I am a scientist in "real life" (outside of LTG :wink: ) and I cringe when I see bad science dumped on the unsuspecting masses in the cause of political correctness.

In the global warming issue, I don't have the scientific expertise in that field to comment on correct versus incorrect, but some of the known facts raise my suspicions about the conclusions that are drawn for the public. For example, they only have global temperature data for the last 162 years, and weather has only been recorded by humanity for less that 400 years (started in England). That's just a pimple on the proverbial elephant's behind in term of global time. Just look at how little we inderstand about El Nino, that was only documented within very recent history. The scientist in me tells me that there may be just too little data to make the jump to far-reaching conclusions about the condition of our planet.

So I try to keep an open mind, but my suspicions are raised. I appreciate your comment. Maybe I should not have taken the Johnny Carson approach of making a joke about serious current events.
 

fronobulax

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Frosty said:
But global warming is *not* something about which I want the scientific community to have the last laugh over the naysayers.

Opinions are like armpits. Everyone has them and everyone else's stink. In that vein, let me say that my opinion is that the scientific community is not unanimous on the subject of global warming. My assessment of the evidence is that the alleged links between human activity and global climate change have not been established to my satisfaction and there are enough people whose work I respect as a scientist (as opposed to a politician) who express similar doubts that I do not think the case is closed.

That said, there is definitely an element much like Pascal's Wager in play here. We are better off doing something because we assume Global Warming is real and human caused than any of the alternatives.
 

Graham

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cjd-player said:
Maybe I should not have taken the Johnny Carson approach of making a joke about serious current events.

That kind of thinking truly saddens me. Also seems to get me in artificially heated water from time to time. That being said, it is one of the things I really enjoy on LTG. For the most part, very like minded people that tend to "chat" at each other as you would talk with your pals in your living room, at the pub, at work, etc.

Not like any other forum that I have yet to be thrown out of. :mrgreen:
 

Guildmark

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"I wouldn't belong to a forum that would have me as a member." - Groucho, paraphrased

The interesting thing to me about global warming is that the effort against it is always heralded as a need to save the planet. Your pardon, but that's a crock. The planet doesn't give a $hit. Once we destroy ourselves, the planet will recover in a few million years and forget all about us. Global warming is about saving human habitat. Period. To that end, we can stop pouring concrete that retains heat and radiates it back. Unless we need more roads on which to drive our Prius.

Oh, my. I need to switch to decaf. :(
 

cjd-player

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Hey Graham, If you get thrown out for your sense of humor, can I come with you??

Well, on second thought, maybe not... When I laugh at your posts I emit CO2, which probably contributes to global warming. :lol: I'll just stop laughing to do my part! :mrgreen:
 

JerryR

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cjd-player said:
Hey Graham, If you get thrown out for your sense of humor, can I come with you??

Well, on second thought, maybe not... When I laugh at your posts I emit CO2, which probably contributes to global warming. :lol: I'll just stop laughing to do my part! :mrgreen:


When I laugh at Grammy's posts I emit methane :oops:
 

cjd-player

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JerryR said:
cjd-player said:
Hey Graham, If you get thrown out for your sense of humor, can I come with you??

Well, on second thought, maybe not... When I laugh at your posts I emit CO2, which probably contributes to global warming. :lol: I'll just stop laughing to do my part! :mrgreen:


When I laugh at Grammy's posts I emit methane :oops:



Well Jerry, If Graham keeps posting, and if you are clever and CAREFUL, you should be able to figure out a way to heat your house this winter.
 

john_kidder

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cjd-player said:
For example, they only have global temperature data for the last 162 years, and weather has only been recorded by humanity for less that 400 years (started in England). That's just a pimple on the proverbial elephant's behind in term of global time. The scientist in me tells me that there may be just too little data to make the jump to far-reaching conclusions about the condition of our planet.

Oh c'mon guys, give this a break. This is actually a fairly important issue, and every now and then it's useful to actually look at a little data before one forms opinions on fairly important issues. There are a whole bundle of opinions, with various weights behind them. Here's what the worldwide scientific community says (and yes, let's acknowledge that there are scientists who believe in Lamarck's theories of adaptation, that there are scientists who believe that quamtum mechanics is all hogwash and that Newton explained every thing, that there are scientists who believe in intelligent design, that there are scientists who believe in who knows what, and there even still a few who disagree with the nearly-complete international consensus ads represented by the International Panel on Climate Change):

  • Warming of the climate system is unequivocal, as is now evident from observations of increases
    in global average air and ocean temperatures, widespread melting of snow and ice, and rising
    global average sea level (Figure 1.1). {WGI 3.2, 4.8, 5.2, 5.5, SPM}
    Eleven of the last twelve years (1995-2006) rank among the twelve warmest years in the instrumental
    record of global surface temperature (since 1850). The 100-year linear trend (1906-2005) of 0.74
    [0.56 to 0.92]°C is larger than the corresponding trend trend of 0.6 [0.4 to 0.8]°C (1901-2000) given
    in the Third Assessment Report (TAR) (Figure 1.1). The linear warming trend over the 50 years 1956-
    2005 (0.13 [0.10 to 0.16]°C per decade) is nearly twice that for the 100 years 1906-2005. {WGI 3.2,
    SPM}
    The temperature increase is widespread over the globe, and is greater at higher northern latitudes
    (Figure 1.2). Average Arctic temperatures have increased at almost twice the global average rate in
    the past 100 years. Land regions have warmed faster than the oceans (Figures 1.2 and 2.5).
    Observations since 1961 show that the average temperature of the global ocean has increased to
    depths of at least 3000 m and that the ocean has been taking up over 80% of the heat being added
    to the climate system. New analyses of balloon-borne and satellite measurements of lower- and midtropospheric
    temperature show warming rates similar to those observed in surface temperature. {WGI
    3.2, 3.4, 5.2, SPM}
    Increases in sea level are consistent with warming (Figure 1.1). Global average sea level rose at an
    average rate of 1.8 [1.3 to 2.3] mm per year over 1961 to 2003 and at an average rate of about 3.1 [2.4
    to 3.8] mm per year from 1993 to 2003. Whether this faster rate for 1993 to 2003 reflects decadal
    variation or an increase in the longer term trend is unclear. Since 1993 thermal expansion of the
    oceans has contributed about 57% of the sum of the estimated individual contributions to the sea level
    rise, with decreases in glaciers and ice-caps contributing about 28% and losses from the polar ice
    sheets contributing the remainder. From 1993 to 2003 the sum of these climate contributions is
    consistent within uncertainties with the total sea level rise that is directly observed. {WGI 4.6, 4.8,
    5.5, SPM, Table SPM.1}
    Observed decreases in snow and ice extent are also consistent with warming (Figure 1.1). Satellite
    data since 1978 show that annual average Arctic sea ice extent has shrunk by 2.7 [2.1 to 3.3]% per
    decade, with larger decreases in summer of 7.4 [5.0 to 9.8]% per decade. Mountain glaciers and snow
    cover on average have declined in both hemispheres. The maximum areal extent of seasonally frozen ground has decreased by about 7% in the Northern Hemisphere since 1900, with decreases in spring
    of up to 15%. Temperatures at the top of the permafrost layer have generally increased since the
    1980s in the Arctic by up to 3°C. {WGI 3.2, 4.5, 4.6, 4.7, 4.8, 5.5, SPM}

    At continental, regional, and ocean basin scales, numerous long-term changes in other aspects of
    climate have also been observed. Trends from 1900 to 2005 have been observed in precipitation
    amount in many large regions. Over this period, precipitation increased significantly in eastern parts
    of North and South America, northern Europe and northern and central Asia whereas precipitation
    declined in the Sahel, the Mediterranean, southern Africa and parts of southern Asia. Globally, the
    area affected by drought has likely increased since the 1970s. {WGI 3.3, 3.9, SPM}

    Some extreme weather events have changed in frequency and/or intensity over the last 50 years:
    • It is very likely that cold days, cold nights and frosts have become less frequent over most land
    areas, while hot days and hot nights have become more frequent. {WGI 3.8, SPM}
    • It is likely that heat waves have become more frequent over most land areas. {WGI 3.8, SPM}
    • It is likely that the frequency of heavy precipitation events (or proportion of total rainfall from
    heavy falls) has increased over most areas. {WGI 3.8, 3.9, SPM}
    • It is likely that the incidence of extreme high sea level3 has increased at a broad range of sites
    worldwide since 1975. {WGI 5.5, SPM}
    There is observational evidence of an increase in intense tropical cyclone activity in the North
    Atlantic since about 1970, and suggestions of increased intense tropical cyclone activity in some other
    regions where concerns over data quality are greater. Multi-decadal variability and the quality of the
    tropical cyclone records prior to routine satellite observations in about 1970 complicate the detection
    of long-term trends in tropical cyclone activity. {WGI 3.8, SPM}
    Average Northern Hemisphere temperatures during the second half of the 20th century were very likely
    higher than during any other 50-year period in the last 500 years and likely the highest in at least the
    past 1300 years. {WGI 6.6, SPM}

    1.2 Observed effects of climate changes
    The statements presented here are based largely on data sets that cover the period since 1970. The
    number of studies of observed trends in the physical and biological environment and their relationship
    to regional climate changes has increased greatly since the TAR. The quality of the data sets has also
    improved. There is a notable lack of geographic balance in data and literature on observed changes,
    with marked scarcity in developing countries. {WGII SPM}
    These studies have allowed a broader and more confident assessment of the relationship between
    observed warming and impacts than was made in the TAR. That Assessment concluded that “there is
    high confidence2 that recent regional changes in temperature have had discernible impacts on physical
    and biological systems”. {WGII SPM}
    Observational evidence from all continents and most oceans shows that many natural systems
    are being affected by regional climate changes, particularly temperature increases. {WGII
    SPM}
    There is high confidence that natural systems related to snow, ice and frozen ground (including
    permafrost) are affected. Examples are:
    • [list:50945]enlargement and increased numbers of glacial lakes {WGII 1.3, SPM}
    • increasing ground instability in permafrost regions, and rock avalanches in mountain regions
    {WGII 1.3, SPM}
    • changes in some Arctic and Antarctic ecosystems , including those in sea-ice biomes, and
    predators at high levels of the food web. {WGII 1.3, 4.4, 15.4, SPM}
Based on growing evidence, there is high confidence that the following effects on hydrological systems are occurring: increased runoff and earlier spring peak discharge in many glacier- and snowfed rivers; and warming of lakes and rivers in many regions, with effects on thermal structure and
water quality. {WGII 1.3, 15.2, SPM}

[/list:u:50945]


And on and on and on it goes. There is just no real doubt any more. And whether or not you like Al Gore doesn't make a rat's arse worth of difference to the strength of his arguments - he's just a highly visible spokesperson for the overwhelming consensus.

Now I know it's way easier to get the news from any number of sources who just love to play up controversy - after all , there's no news if everyone agrees, so the various mad hatters out there get hundreds of times the airplay of the norm. But, if you are even remotely interested in forming your own opinion based on facts and analysis, then I suggest you read some of the same. If you are even remotely interested, here's a good place to start Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change Fourth Assessment Report.

If you're not interested enough to find out, if you prefer any of the various myths, or if you think that this issue is properly reported by the same folks who bring us Britney and the latest news from Disneyland, then of course you're free to carry on as you wish. But this is rapidly becoming a regular old "Lead, Follow or Get Out Of The Way" sort of thing.

Now I will shut up and stick to guitars and amps on this board. There, our individual subjective opinions are what we deal in. When we talk about the future of our species and others, it's better to listen to them that knows.

Over and out.
 

West R Lee

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I heard today that our galaxy is actually cooling, thus causing the perceived warming of the globe effect.

West
 

chazmo

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With over 18" since Thursday, I've gotta' get my camera out. We had an amazing ice glaze this morning that I missed photographing. :(
 

cjd-player

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I was born in 1956.
I apologize to everyone if I am the cause of the increased linear warming trend.
My wife says that I do fart a lot when I'm sleeping.
 

chazmo

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Graham said:
Chazmo said:
With over 18" since Thursday, I've gotta' get my camera out. We had an amazing ice glaze this morning that I missed photographing. :(

That is just amazing to see isn't it? When the morning sun hits it, definitely need photos.

I was cresting this hill at around 9am, and the sun was just blasting through the branches of this frozen tree... Darn, I wish I'd had my camera! :banghead:
 
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