Guild tubes

West R Lee

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Ok Bob, let us know when you're ready to try, we'll listen from the bomb shelter. Kinda like when Teller and Einstein scadaddled when they blew the big one. They actually thought they might start a chain reaction which might ignite the atmosphere and wipe out the world.

I will give you 3-1 ods myself on igniting the world, .................how far is Texas from you Bob?

West
 

dklsplace

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how far is Texas from you Bob?

:lol: :lol:


I've done it a number of times. Fire extinguishers aren't needed. As far as a technical explanation...I've asked my amp guru to come up with some "geezer friendly" verbage. :wink:
 

bobgoblin

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Texas...from me? Sheeeee-it, 'bout right under my feet, bub. I was born 'n raised in Texas, ain't nuthin' like it nowheres. I'm in Lubbock right now, but my head's in the hill country...
 

Jeff

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DKLS,

Am I hearing you right? Experimenting around with the input & output sources in not likely to cause damage. I have always been leery of plugging something in backwards & baking something. I've worked with electricity a bit (as opposed to electronics, obviously) & have toasted a few multimeters.

Interesting thread.

There are 7 input & out put jacks in the back of my amp. Eliminate one mystery, headphones, leaves 6, one or two have to be for effects pedals I'm guessing, so what now. The pin jack labelled "Direct Out" I would think would be a good place to start pluggin in a downstream amp.

Schematics would lend a bit of confidence. Depending on footnotes & disclaimers. As I recall there were no schematics included in my users manual.
 

dklsplace

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Am I hearing you right? Experimenting around with the input & output sources in not likely to cause damage?

NoNoNoNoNo!!!!! Experimenting with input & output sources IS hazardous! :shock: Just as Bob said in his post....NEVER contect a speaker output into the front end of another amp!

On "most" 2 input amps (input 1 is high gain, input 2 has a 6db pad), both inputs are connected. So the input signal from one, is "present" in the other.

Here's the requested geezer friendly explanation:

"They are meant to have to
guitars share the same channel, or in the event of too strong a
signal that would cause distortion to the first stage, the input 2 is
padded down 6 dB from input 1. Conveniently, when sending a signal
into one jack, it will also appear on the other jack if something is
plugged into it, thus can be used as a source for another amp. There
is usually not much denegration of the signal, but it depends on what
amps and what guitars are used. To check, turn the volume down all
the way on amp #2 and unplug and plug back in to the unused input on
the channel of amp 1 with your instrument hooked up and playing to
see if it makes a diff having amp #2 plugged in. Use several diff
volume settings to see.

Make sure the amps are phased correctly if they are to be used with
the baffle boards of the speakers lined up in the same plane. You
don't want the speakers of one out of phase with the speakers of the
other."

Jeff, are you familiar with DI boxes & how they function. That's likely your "Direct Out"
 

Jeff

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DKLS,

Thakns for the affirmation regarding the perils of cross wiring inputs & outputs. Cross wiring could indeed cause a cross fire.

DI box? Direct in?

I spent some time on Ultrasounds website last night. Still no schematics but I think I understand the Direct Out function.

Direct out takes whatever is coming out of the amp & moves it out to a PA, or another amp or whatever you plug into it, leaving the amp itself doing it's thing perhaps used as a monitor. I haven't tried it yet but it sounded straight forward. The rest of the info about effects loops & such needs to simmer in my mind a while longer.

Interesting diversification built in with the 2 inputs connected. My mechanical mind has a hard time understanding this technology. Seems like voodoo and Why would reverb cause problems.?

It's not a urgent issue yet, I won't be touring till late Summer & have plenty of time to get the bugs worked out.
 

bobgoblin

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reverb causes trouble because there is a phase reversal going on w/the signal when reverb is active. combining this reverse phased signal w/a straight signal leads to cancellation of certain sonics.

yes, as you say, DI creates a PA-ready (or mixing console-ready) signal. your amp will still function as a monitor (which is nice, & different from a headphone out jack like on my roland, which silences the speaker). more newer DI devices have some kind of speaker simulator because our ears are not accustomed to hearing guitar sounds w/o speaker "color".

an effects loop injects signal (usually from some effects doohickey) in-between the preamp & power amp sections (input & output, respectively). this allows us to shape our tone w/o the interference of the tone stack built into the amp. basically, we plug into the preamp section, which amplifies the tiny signal from our guitars, then the signal gets intercepted by the effects loop, where modulation/time-based effects work best, then to the power amp section, for final amplification & transmission to the speaker(s). that's how i understand it, anyway.
 

dklsplace

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This is turning into a pretty informative thread.

DI is Direct Inject, or Direct Injection. Here's a short to the point explanation from arx.com

"DI Boxes find applications interfacing usually Unbalanced (also known as Single Ended) signal sources like: Drum machines, Guitar and Bass instruments and amplifiers, Keyboards, Computers, Samplers, etc to the Balanced world of mixing console inputs for live sound, recording and broadcast.

In Electronics terms DI Boxes act as High Impedance active buffers enabling low or high impedance unbalanced equipment or instruments to be connected to low impedance balanced signal lines by providing two output signals of equal amplitude or level but opposite in phase. When these two signals are recombined in a mixing console's Balanced Microphone input stage, any Hum or R.F interference which may have been introduced into the preceding cabling is effectively cancelled out or removed from the signal."
 

West R Lee

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OK guys, now I've truly got my tail between my legs and am running for cover. I told you guys I'm really just an acoustic man! Wow, ya'll are way over my head now!

West
 

West R Lee

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Bob,

Love the Hill Country. I've spent some time in the Austin/SanAntonio area. Done a bunch of hunting around Hondo. God's country! I'm way up here in the Northeast Piney Woods.

West
 

bobgoblin

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yeah, that texas hill country will pull at yer heart strings, don't it?
 

West R Lee

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Not to mention all of the great music that has come from that area! Especially Austin.

West
 

Benee Wafers

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O.K. WRL. Just stay where you're at and we'll send a search party.... bye and bye.
Benee
 

john_kidder

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What a great little chat that turned to to be. I'm going home to play with my Thunderbass and my Roland JC-55.

If I get this right, I plug a guitar into Input 1 on the Thunderbass. That will also give a signal presence on Input 2, which is live if and only if there's a plug in the Input 2 jack. So I can jumper from Input 2 for a feed to the Jazz Chorus.

Too cool. I'll try it and report.

Cheers,
 

megadan

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I've successfully jumped the channels on my Thunderbass many times. So have many others, with other amps. It works quite well.
I didn't believe it at first but now it's quite clear. The electricity doesn't care whether something is labeled an 'input' or an 'output' - it just follows the path of least resistance. Since both inputs are connected, the signal will travel out of the 'input' into the second channel if you run a cord between them... cool!
 

wabash slim

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amps

Inputs on amps ARE paralleled. You can jumper from one amp to another, but, there is a law of diminishing returns. Sooner or later you run out of signal level as you've spread it too thin.
NEVER go from a speaker out to another amp input. Inputs want to see 1/2 volt at almopst no amperage. Putting 40watts WILL fry the second amp and possibly the first. I'm a geezer and a geek---I work in live sound at a major theater, and have been doing music since 63.
Some of this I've learned the hard way.
To get some kind of "stereo", try using an effects device that has two outputs(i.e., Nanoverb) from a mono input, and run those to two different amps. Just sending a mono sound to two amps will give somewhat of an effect, but, not too noticeable unless the amps are wildly different.
Even a line out may have too much drive for a guitar amp input.
Just remember, all amps run on smoke. If you let the smoke out of the amp, it won't work anymore
 

Jeff

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I've been sticking to my AB switch while you guys work this all out. So far no smoke has escaped from my amps.
 

dklsplace

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Jeff said:
I've been sticking to my AB switch while you guys work this all out. So far no smoke has escaped from my amps.

What's there to work out Jeff? Who do you need to hear "it works" from before you'll believe it? :p I used this setup live just last weekend with outstanding results!
 
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