What do model numbers tell us?

Charlie Bernstein

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What do Guild model numbers and letters tell us about where, when, how, and of what they were made?

Do different years give the model numbers different meanings?
 
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fronobulax

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Why do I feel like I am going the rabbit hole of answering rhetorical questions?

A model designation or number is at the heart, just a short hand way of referring to a set of specifications.

Guild never was especially consistent in using the same specs for the same model designations. Thus for a model number to be a useful shorthand you need to pick a time period because specs changed but model numbers didn't. So if you want to get from a model number and a year then you need to find a catalog and then deal with the fact that not all catalog specs are correct.

If you are looking for consistency and a magic decoder you are not going to find it except perhaps for some of the Guilds (re)named under CMG. They published a scheme were you could just read the model number and determine body size, country of origin, some of the wood used and whether there were factory electronics (or not) but even that has not been followed consistently.

I will leave it to someone else to find a link to that scheme since it has been discussed at LTG including how much the CMG scheme differs from some history and how CMG is no longer consistent with their own scheme.

What do Guild model numbers and letters tell us about where, when, how, and of what they were made?

They tell us pretty much nothing, especially if you want a generalization that applies to the entire corp[orate lifetime of Guild.

Do different years give the model numbers different meanings?

Yes.
 

GAD

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…and no.

Some models have remained unchanged. Some have changed a great deal.

Some, especially in the electric side of things, were only made for a few short years (s300 as an example). Knowing that you can discern the factory.

Some, like the S100, have changed shape and been made in damn, near all the factories and in multiple countries.
 

GGJaguar

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What makes me crazy is the recycling of model numbers (X-150 and X-160 for example) and even names like Savoy and Stuart. It's so confusing.
 

AcornHouse

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Hans devotes a page in The Bible for the various model designations and meanings, at least as far as it covers (New York, Hoboken, (early) Westerly). I believe that scheme was (mostly) followed up to the Gruhn years, when things got changed in the acoustic side. The import guitars also have their own scheme that has changed under different owners. And Oxnard has shown a propensity for scrapping tradition and going their own way.

I fear a comprehensive answer would require a full chapter these days.
 

Charlie Bernstein

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Why do I feel like I am going the rabbit hole of answering rhetorical questions?
Now, THAT is a rhetorical question! Mine wasn't. I was really looking for some answers.
A model designation or number is at the heart, just a short hand way of referring to a set of specifications.

Guild never was especially consistent in using the same specs for the same model designations. Thus for a model number to be a useful shorthand you need to pick a time period because specs changed but model numbers didn't. So if you want to get from a model number and a year then you need to find a catalog and then deal with the fact that not all catalog specs are correct.

If you are looking for consistency and a magic decoder you are not going to find it except perhaps for some of the Guilds (re)named under CMG. They published a scheme were you could just read the model number and determine body size, country of origin, some of the wood used and whether there were factory electronics (or not) but even that has not been followed consistently.

I will leave it to someone else to find a link to that scheme since it has been discussed at LTG including how much the CMG scheme differs from some history and how CMG is no longer consistent with their own scheme.

They tell us pretty much nothing, especially if you want a generalization that applies to the entire corp[orate lifetime of Guild.

Yes.
Thanks! That helps.
 
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SFIV1967

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I was really looking for some answers.
Best would be starting with page 48 in Hans book as Chris mentioned. Way too much to cover here but on the other hand there are multiple threads in LTG already discussing that topic, for instance:


For the CMG era you might want to check this page out:
https://guildguitars.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/guild-acoustic-naming-structure.pdf

Ralf
 

chazmo

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Charlie, another place to get "information" about model names is Gruhn's Guide to Vintage Guitars. This documents yet another period of Guild history when they wanted to mess with the names that wasn't covered in Hans' vol I.

My own feeling is that there are definitely some general rules of thumb you can make about the Guild models, but there are almost always exceptions to these, whether due to mistakes by the factory floor or dictate by management.
 

Charlie Bernstein

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Charlie, another place to get "information" about model names is Gruhn's Guide to Vintage Guitars. This documents yet another period of Guild history when they wanted to mess with the names that wasn't covered in Hans' vol I.

My own feeling is that there are definitely some general rules of thumb you can make about the Guild models, but there are almost always exceptions to these, whether due to mistakes by the factory floor or dictate by management.
Thanks! I'm mainly wondering what the 100 and 200 series acoustics are. I'm starting to think that they're imported and that the 200s are solid wood.

Am I getting warm?
 

Charlie Bernstein

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Best would be starting with page 48 in Hans book as Chris mentioned. Way too much to cover here but on the other hand there are multiple threads in LTG already discussing that topic, for instance:


For the CMG era you might want to check this page out:
https://guildguitars.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/guild-acoustic-naming-structure.pdf

Ralf
Thanks for that link! It's a nice thread. Appreciate the lead.
 

chazmo

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Thanks! I'm mainly wondering what the 100 and 200 series acoustics are. I'm starting to think that they're imported and that the 200s are solid wood.

Am I getting warm?
At least I can give you some info on these. Those are import acoustics, namely GADs or, more recently, Westerly series, Charlie. 100s are solid wood. As far as I recall GADs had no 200s. The 200s are all arched backs, I think, and are Westerly series, only. Hope that helps, Charlie. You can see current information on these (not from GAD series, but Westerly series only) at https://guildguitars.com/guitars/acoustic-guitars/westerly-collection/
 

GAD

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I don't think the GADs had 100s either, though I'm no expert there.

Here's a GAD-era catalog:


Here's a Westerly Collection catalog:

 

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Gibson had the right idea - the model number matched the original price!

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SFIV1967

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I don't think the GADs had 100s either...
They did. Some years before CMG issued "The Westerly Collection" the GAD models were redesigned by FMIC and renamed with 1xx model numbers. That happened in September 2011.



1660402122755.png

Ralf
 

Charlie Bernstein

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They did. Some years before CMG issued "The Westerly Collection" the GAD models were redesigned by FMIC and renamed with 1xx model numbers. That happened in September 2011.



1660402122755.png

Ralf
Where were GADs made?
 
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