New Guild D-55/Dealer Requirements

[george kraushaar]

I visited a local Guild dealer, Acoustic Corner in Black Mountain. They had a slightly shopworn new D-55. It was a great sounding and playing guitar, a fine example of the new factory's work. They had it priced at $1808.00, which sounds pretty good. It was their last Guild. They are dropping the line because of Fender's onerous dealership requirements, or so they say.

 

[marcellis]

What are the requirements?

 

[Beal]

Last time I was in that store they told me the same thing. They had a bunch of the imports and this D55 as well. Nice store and good people.
I'm not sure what the requirements are but it seems to me this isn't the time to be heavy handed in how you treat your customers, but what do I know, I just used to run a gas station.

 

[george kraushaar]

They didn't tell me the whole deal. Something about Fender telling them which models they had to stock and a minimum inventory at all times, which they sound unacceptable.

Martin has also dumped a number of dealers recently over similar issues. If you want a Martin in Asheville, you'll have to go out of town to fine one

 

[Qvart]

I visited a local Guild dealer, Acoustic Corner in Black Mountain.

There's a Guild dealer in Black Mountain?!?!? Why was I not informed of this?

 

[Qvart]

... but what do I know, I just used to run a gas station.

I still do - and all this talk about guitar manufacturers and their requirements reminds me of some of the companies I deal with and their contract requirements. The end result of cutthroat tactics - no Guild or Martin presence in Asheville. But you can find all the Gibsons and Taylors you want. So who's winning?

 

[jgmaute]

Our local store used to carry Martin and Taylor. Then Taylor upped the ante and he had to choose which one to keep because the local population just doesn't buy that many high end guitars. He stayed with Martin. He also carries Rainsong so there probably isn't as much of a demand on the part of the company, perhaps because the company is new. There is a low-end guitar brand he started carrying that really is good for the price. It's called Vineyard. They have an interesting philosophy. They believe in the small independent music stores and only sell to them, no big box, no huge online. We all want the expertise of the independent stores but the guitar companies are making it hard for them to carry a nice selection. joan

 

[jimistone]

Guitar Center will be the only place one can buy these high end guitars before it's over with IMO. It will either be Guitar Center or online purchasing. I have been willing to pay more for an instrument at a small store because I like the personal service...plus I know that they must make a higher profit margin to stay afloat.
I hate to see the small mom and pop music stores fall by the wayside but I don't see how they can still hang in there with all the obstacles they are now facing.
When guitar center finally goes bankrupt the big name guitar companies will want to ease off their inventory requirements to get their product back in the small stores but there may not be any small stores left at that point.

 

[NEONMOONY]

Good or bad, it's not that uncommon in merchandising for a company to require, in order to be a dealer, that the store have minimum amount of merchandise.

 

[Qvart]

Good or bad, it's not that uncommon in merchandising for a company to require, in order to be a dealer, that the store have minimum amount of merchandise.

Yep, and to require certain items are "never-out." However, that doesn't automatically result in excessive inventory requirements. The contracts I have to abide by have similar constrictions, but some of them are quite reasonable. I don't see a problem with inventory requirements in general - after all, if a company is going to invest in a dealer and a contract, there should be some guarantees in place that the dealer will stock certain items and perform at a certain level. That doesn't mean that companies should strong arm these small retailers into an untenable situation and use them as little more than weapons against their competitors. There are different tactics that could be employed that would better benefit dealers and (and, I think, the Guild brand), but for whatever reason FMIC is doing what they're doing. And we seem no closer to figuring it out than when we were discussing this in other threads!

All I can say is there is no Guitar Center anywhere near my town, and I hope it stays that way. The two main shops in town are doing just fine whether they have Guild and Martin or not. I think it would be good if they were able to handle inventory from those companies, but in the end a lot of their revenue comes from modestly-priced beginner and intermediate level instruments - one is a Fender dealer and one is a Gibson dealer, so there are a lot of MIM's and Epiphones out there (I think they all carry Ibanez too). A third shop - that the Guild website lists as a dealer - does well with Fender, Takamine, and Yamaha, and a lot of their business comes from school band members (and they haven't actually been a Guild dealer for years now). Then there's the shop I take my guitars to, but they only deal in used instruments and amps, and they have a recording studio and have begun producing their own line of pedals. I have a feeling if you ask all these businesses what improvements they could see or new business they could attract by carrying Guild, I doubt they would be ready to jump at the opportunity, especially if FMIC keeps the requirements so stringent. If the inventory requirements were relaxed a bit I think these shops would be great for promoting at least the more moderately-priced Guilds as they are the kind of places where you can still interact with the sales staff and not feel like you're lost in a box store.

 

[jwsamuel]

But you can find all the Gibsons and Taylors you want. So who's winning?

What's odd about that is that Gibson was one of the first to impose requirements and lost a lot of dealers a couple of years ago as a result.

Jim

 

[Qvart]

What's odd about that is that Gibson was one of the first to impose requirements and lost a lot of dealers a couple of years ago as a result.

And they may have suffered a little, but there's no shortage of Gibsons out there. Of course, brand recognition goes a long way, and people still look for the G and F names. Too bad Guild didn't build their name as well back in the day, but then we'd all probably have to pay more for our guitars!

I visited a local Guild dealer, Acoustic Corner in Black Mountain. They had a slightly shopworn new D-55...They are dropping the line because of Fender's onerous dealership requirements, or so they say.

I went by there today for the first time. Cool little shop! I got the same story - they just can't handle the requirements to be a Guild dealer, and the guy there sounded a bit disappointed.

Now, I've never played a D55, Westerly or otherwise, so I can't compare this one to the others, but THAT is one BEAUTIFUL guitar! I decided to go out there and check out the sound of it because I was thinking I might like a rosewood guitar in the future just to have a little variety. I gotta say it's less twangy than I expected. Everything nicely balanced (of course) with plenty of the lower end I like. Now I really want to try out a Westerly model that has had time to age. Oh, the bling kinda messed with my eyes a bit though - I'm used to my plain old dots and black binding!

In the end, the shop is trying to get rid of that one then they'll be done with Guild. Maybe down the road they'll settle for less, then I'd consider it.

 

[Beal]

If you need repair work done there's a guy there at Acoustic Corner in Black Mountain, John, who does very good work.

 

[J45dale]

Yes I feel your pain, I am up in the Roanoke Va area without a Gibson dealer anywhere.
Due to some brilliant marketing plan...or the peter principal at work.
We still have Guild, Martin and Taylor full service stores...and no big box dealers, so who did Gibson protect???
As I believe in playing before paying my newest Gibson is now a 72 model. Not true for Guild and Martin.
Dale.

 

[6L6]

I feel it's just imperative for all dealers to get a website up and open themselves to the Internet.

Here in California we have to pay about 10% sales tax. Thanks to the likes of Pelosi, Boxer, Feinstein, etc., we are $20BB in the hole and have public schools ranked #48 out of 50. Still, most Californians feel that's outstanding performance and reelect these people over and over.

To hell with that, I say!

SO... I don't feel bad about buying a guitar out-of-state once in awhile to save the sales tax. It's a big chunck of money when buying an expensive guitar. The world is your oyster if you're a guitar dealer with a good website. Not taking advantage of this technology is foolish and detrimental to the bottomline.

6

 

[fronobulax]

SO... I don't feel bad about buying a guitar out-of-state once in awhile to save the sales tax.

Not that it is easily enforceable, but the Commonwealth of Virginia imposes a Use Tax which is imposed on goods bought out of state by residents and - surprise, surprise - is the same rate as the resident's local sales tax. You are supposed to self-report Use Tax and pay it on your state income tax form. If I buy a guitar out of state and don't pay the Use Tax then I am technically a tax evader.

 

[capnjuan]

... Here in California we have to pay about 10% sales tax. Thanks to the likes of Pelosi, Boxer, Feinstein, etc., we are $20BB in the hole and have public schools ranked #48 out of 50. Still, most Californians feel that's outstanding performance and reelect these people over and over.

Hi 6; yes, you're getting screwed - you're paying too much for bad schools. Consider Florida where we had Jeb Bush for two terms, another from Charles Crist, send Mel Martinez to the Senate and their party runs the Legislature ... and they all bat for the other team. We only pay 6% plus local add-ons for crappy schools so, if you want bad schools but don't want to pay as much, c'mon down.

 

[adorshki]

Not that it is easily enforceable, but the Commonwealth of Virginia imposes a Use Tax which is imposed on goods bought out of state by residents and - surprise, surprise - is the same rate as the resident's local sales tax. You are supposed to self-report Use Tax and pay it on your state income tax form. If I buy a guitar out of state and don't pay the Use Tax then I am technically a tax evader.

That is actually also true here in California. I'm not even going to go into the merits of denying the tax income to our already cash-strapped state, and I'm a native so read between THOSE lines...but here're my real caveats:
A: I also believe in play before pay. (except when it comes to keeping a significant other happy :lol Can't do THAT over the internet.
B: Rare as it might be, look at all the fun some of our members have had when a new purchase is delivered in a severely damaged condition.
C: Finally and most importantly, I seriously doubt you will ever find one of these in a REAL music store:
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=16641
Support your local dealer! (No not THAT dealer!)

 

[jte]

Dealer requirements aren't new at all, and have been around since at least the '70s. Gibson, no matter who has owned them has always been the worst. Our little store in a college town in the middle of Central Illinois had a Gibson rep tell us we needed to have an L-5 and either a Super 400 or a Super 5 (? it was supposed to have the best features of the Super 400 and the L-5). The only thing Gibson made that our customers wanted were Les Pauls, SGs, and some ES-335. But to get those we were supposed to have a Dobro, an F-5 repro Mandolin, etc. etc. Decades later the last Gibson dealer in town dropped them for the same reasons- they were a five store chain and the annual commitment went from what the whole chain had sold the year before to that dollar amount per store. Plus, 40% of the hooks had to be Gibson/Epiphone product, and an additional commitment for Gibson-branded accessories.

Now part of this is understandable- I hate that every Fender dealer seems to have a hundred black MIM Standard Strats with maple necks, 25 MIM Teles, five Standard Jazz basses, and a single P bass. But never any of the Vintage Series stuff, nor more than one American Series. They have to be able to represent the line in order to be a dealer. But the annual commitments also have to reflect the stores' markets, which they too often ignore.

John

 

[chazmo]

These are surely tough times for the small retail stores. I really feel for them. It is in this vein that I question any dealer strong-arming by the vendors. I freely admit, though, that it is an equally difficult time for the manufacturers as well. They (Fender, etc.) have large capital investments in their production staff. What can you do?