Opinions on this D25M

Hi all -
I'm new to the forum and am looking to purchase my first vintage Guild! I found a 1979 D25M in my area and am looking for opinions on the price/condition. The seller is asking for $580. He notes in the description "No alterations have been done, but when I bought it there was a crack in the bottom that had been professionally repaired (see photos)." He is the second owner, purchased it with the repair already done in 1998. He said he hasn't had any issues with it nor have any new cracks emerged. Do you all think this is still a decent deal? I'm not too worried about about the cosmetics side of it, but am looking to be able to play it for years to come, so more worried about the structure itself. I also asked him if it has had a neck reset. He said he hadn't played it in a while so he "adjusted the neck a couple weeks ago and the action is good." What thoughts do you all have?

Anyways he seems like a really nice guy. I'll probably go check it out this week. Anything else I should look for/ask about? Thanks!

Looks just like my '79 D25M.


Mine has a couple of side cracks just like that one, they've never been cleated or repaired and have been stable for a couple of decades. Having said that, do check the bridge to make sure the bridge hasn't pulled up. Check the action up around the 12th fret and ensure the neck is nice and straight. Check your saddle height and make sure you have at least 1/8" protruding from the saddle slot above the bridge, more height would be even better.

If all looks good, $580 or so sounds pretty reasonable to me. They are fabulous guitars. I'll have to check my serial # and see how closely related the two are. Mine is #100103 and I bought it new in '79. I believe that one is a '77 or '78 based on the serial #.

West

One thing to consider with any guitar of this vintage, is if you are willing to invest in any necessary repairs. Sometimes, you may be able to play the instrument, as is, without having them done. If you can get a trial period to have it evaluated by someone competent to determine something like a neck reset, that would prove helpful. Speaking recently with some experts, though not in person due to distance, of a recently acquired used & older guitar. The following was relayed to me:

That in order to determine the need for a neck reset. In addition to determining whether or not the bridge, or saddle have been altered... ('A few things were necessary')

• An instrument that is strong to pitch
• An instrument that is properly set up
• A special type of straight edge

I was also told that, if I could play it as is now, fine - with the action comfortable from frets 10-15, then I may be good to go. So I'd say if you can play it & are happy with it. Then for that price it might be worth it, provided you are willing to accept any potential repairs that you are unable to determine while on hand and on your own. Good luck! They are phenomenal instruments. One thing I've learned, for myself, is that I have become sensitive, especially to fret-wear in the first position. In a way that I never was before. So that is something I always keep in mind, regardless of who tells me that it is, "Fine."

Another thing I have learned in regards this type of fret-wear. Is that: I can't often tell, just by photos how bad it's going to be, "for me." What I mean by that -- is, I've seen instances where the pictures looked like the frets were fine, to my eye. And then gotten them in my hand, and found it out to be an entirely 'different,' story! And vice versa, as well...

That looks like a great deal, guitar has some mojo, and really, heck for that price it’s totally worth taking a flyer on it, good luck!

^ All good advice above, Kerb. And, again, welcome aboard.

I think that's a great price if the guitar is playable. I can't really tell from your pictures but the saddle looks low. I also can't see if there are any signs of neck block trouble. Look for cracks along the fretboard extension and look very carefully at the neck joint.

The issue to beware of here is whether the neck has shifted and whether you can't get it set up properly without having the neck worked on. Still at that price, this could be a great guitar to have!

Indeed looks like a '79 serial number. I think West R Lee has a typo in the s/n of "his" D-25M, above (his probably starts with "200", not "100").

I think I see a little wooden cleat on the inside of the body of "your" guitar, where a side crack is glued. That cleat is a good thing.

IMO the price is excellent. It even gives you some headroom, if repairs are needed.

As pointed out by Chazmo & others above, you'll need to look at the neck angle to determine whether the guitar needs a neck reset. Bring a long straightedge, if you have one available, & see where it meets the bridge (i.e. below, or equal to, or slightly above the top of the bridge).

This link shows how to check neck angle with a 24-inch straightedge:

Checking Neck Angle - frets.com

I don't have anything to add to the excellent advice you've received; I just wanted to welcome you to LTG. If you do wind up buying the D25M, please come back and tell us about it.

geoguy said:

Indeed looks like a '79 serial number. I think West R Lee has a typo in the s/n of "his" D-25M, above (his probably starts with "200", not "100").

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No, he just forgot to include the serial number prefix, so it should be #DA100103.

Sincerely,

Hans Moust
www.guitarsgalore.nl

hansmoust said:

No, he just forgot to include the serial number prefix, so it should be #DA100103.

Sincerely,

Hans Moust
www.guitarsgalore.nl

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Hans, are you EVER wrong? Hans is correct.....as always.
DA100103.

West

hansmoust said:

No, he just forgot to include the serial number prefix, so it should be #DA100103.

Sincerely,

Hans Moust
www.guitarsgalore.nl

Click to expand...

What year was the guitar in question built Hans?........'77 maybe? '78?

West

Pay attention to @geoguy link to checking the neck angle and take a 24" straight edge with you. There's not any good shots of the saddle but it looks like it might be low. May need a neck reset. And at that price it's not a terrible thing but it depends on if you want to take the time and invest in work being done. Maybe you can knock off a few more bucks? Worth a shot.

I don't trust anyone who says "the action is good." I have had sellers tell me that and then I get a measure from them and the low E is anywhere from 9/64" to 12/64" over the 12th fret. With the saddle as it looks to be, if the action is > 6/64", then it is not "good."
But, a reset is not the end of the world and the structure of these D-25s is solid enough that a $500 reset and $350 refret could have it playing as well (and sounding as good) as any $3,000-$5,000 Martin or Gibson. You just have to be ok with having a $1,600 guitar that looks like that. For the record, I am one of those that is perfectly happy with that! Just don't let anyone tell you all you need is to shave down the bridge a bit, you want the strings at the bridge about 0.42"-0.50" above the top.

I paid $1,100 (it had already had a reset) and I spent $350 on new frets.

West R Lee said:

What year was the guitar in question built Hans?........'77 maybe? '78?

West

Click to expand...

That guitar was also completed during the year 1979. It was the year that the serial number system with 2-letter prefix and six numbers was introduced, so you will find both systems on instruments from that same year.

Sincerely,

Hans Moust
www.guitarsgalore.nl

hansmoust said:

That guitar was also completed during the year 1979. It was the year that the serial number system with 2-letter prefix and six numbers was introduced, so you will find both systems on instruments from that same year.

Sincerely,

Hans Moust
www.guitarsgalore.nl

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Thank you sir.

West

Kerb that looks nice. Take the above advice and keep us posted.

The ones built in '79 are my absolute favorite, and there seem to be a lot of them. The price would be too rich for me. I've seen like new condition online in that range. Sure some places are asking much more. I'd be in at $450 unless it's a perfect player.

Just realize that adjusting action with the truss rod is not adjusting action, it's adjusting relief. This is a common, most likely out of ignorance, maybe not, mask for needing a reset. If the bridge is thin it likely has been shaved. But if the action is good for you now, all you can surmise is that. No prediction of the future is possible. Markets are very different. Take a straightedge and resting it along the neck it should clear or kiss the bridge. Any lower would indicate degrees of neck angle issues.

Br1ck said:

Just realize that adjusting action with the truss rod is not adjusting action, it's adjusting relief. This is a common, most likely out of ignorance, maybe not, mask for needing a reset. If the bridge is thin it likely has been shaved. But if the action is good for you now, all you can surmise is that. No prediction of the future is possible. Markets are very different. Take a straightedge and resting it along the neck it should clear or kiss the bridge. Any lower would indicate degrees of neck angle issues.

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The straightedge measure works if the bridge is at least 0.3125” tall. I had someone send me a pic of a guitar passing the straightedge test, but the bridge was shaved down to 0.23” tall. It actually sounds great, but a reset and new bridge would be ideal.

With a fresh $500-$900 reset, it’s worth $1,200.

But the op has been AWOL, so I’m guessing the deal fell through.

It is still a subject worth discussion. It is the old value vs restoration dilemma. I was all in on my D 35 for $1400 about ten years ago when it would have been worth around $1000. Yet I've had ten years enjoying the guitar, and I'd expect to at least get that if I ever sell. Since I'm not going to sell, it's a moot point.

Since I'm not going to sell, my house being worth $1.2M is meaningless. Lest you envision a $3500 sq ft. house on a half acre, my house is 1200 SQ ft on a decent urban lot. Yes, It's good to know I could sell out and be fine living somewhere else, but that won't happen. It's akin to someone having bought a pre war D 28 decades ago for $18,000. It won't do you any good if you aren't selling.

Br1ck said:

It is still a subject worth discussion. It is the old value vs restoration dilemma. I was all in on my D 35 for $1400 about ten years ago when it would have been worth around $1000. Yet I've had ten years enjoying the guitar, and I'd expect to at least get that if I ever sell. Since I'm not going to sell, it's a moot point.

Since I'm not going to sell, my house being worth $1.2M is meaningless. Lest you envision a $3500 sq ft. house on a half acre, my house is 1200 SQ ft on a decent urban lot. Yes, It's good to know I could sell out and be fine living somewhere else, but that won't happen. It's akin to someone having bought a pre war D 28 decades ago for $18,000. It won't do you any good if you aren't selling.

Click to expand...

Oh, I'm with you 100%. I find it weird that people balk at being into a guitar (money-wise) for more than it is worth. Are they are saying that the guitar is only worth it if it is free? I don't think I'd have three 1970s Guilds (with another on the way) if I was told they were worth zero, but I figure I will be able to use these for 10-20 years for about $400 each (not including strings). The money went into new frets and a setup on each of them. Not a bad deal, IMO.